What June fight is most interesting to you?
by Scott Christ on May 29, 2009 4:48 PM EDT
in Boxing Fight Previews
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We won't go in-depth here, instead saving that for a later time, but June is a month that deserves its attention, and since we're almost there, I'm curious to know what fight y'all are most looking forward to, because there's a lot of options stylistically.
The Heavyweights: Wladimir Klitschko and former cruiserweight king David Haye will collide on June 20 (HBO), and for my money this is most interesting heavyweight fight in years, and the first time in a long time I've actually been looking forward to a heavyweight bout -- like the idea of watching it, not just what happens.
Klitschko (52-3, 46 KO) is riding a 10-fight winning streak, which includes Ws over the likes of Chris Byrd, Lamon Brewster, Sultan Ibragimov, Hasim Rahman, and other fairly notable names of the current generation of heavies. But not one of those fights has been truly exciting. Usually, Klitschko has simply dominated with his jab, which is great for his record but poison for fans watching at home most times. The only stoppage that really sticks out during his recent run is his thunderous knockout of Calvin Brock.
Haye (22-1, 21 KO) came to the heavyweight division officially with a chaotic stoppage of Monte "Two Gunz" Barrett last November. He's angered both Klitschko brothers and a number of fans with his brash t-shirts and talk leading up to this fight. Frankly if he gets knocked out in short order (which many think will happen), he'll be eating a ton of crow. That's part of what makes this so interesting, though.
The Welterweights: Miguel Cotto tuned up with a February win over non-contender Michael Jennings, but now he's going back into the fire. His opponent on June 13 (HBO) is no tune-up: Joshua Clottey is a top five welterweight and a tough customer.
Last report was that 12,000 tickets have already been sold at Madison Square Garden for Cotto's fight with Clottey, and the biggest reason Clottey can't get more good fights is he has zero star power to go with being a rough opponent, so that speaks very highly of Cotto's fan standing right now. MSG should be awesome for this fight.
Cotto is hoping to land a fight with Manny Pacquiao should he win, but Pacquiao seems disinterested. More likely could be a rematch between Cotto and Shane Mosley. But Joshua Clottey is a very live dog here, and not much of a dog in the minds of many. If Clottey wins, that throws a wrench into a lot of potential plans, and then people simply have to fight him. Both fighters are promoted by Top Rank, but I've got the suspicion that Bob Arum will be quietly rooting for Cotto, his second-biggest cash cow.
The Sleeper Fight: Victor Ortiz bothers me when he gives interviews because he's a little "Bill & Ted," but the young man is there to fight and stop his opponents. Marcos Maidana recently acquitted himself quite well against Andriy Kotelnik. Ortiz and Golden Boy are showing a lot of brass taking a fight with Maidana, who is very high-risk and very low-reward. Maidana is still entirely unknown in the States. They headline HBO Boxing After Dark (June 27), and are paired with a nice rematch, too.
The Rematch: Chris John and Rocky Juarez went to an entertaining draw in February on the Marquez-Diaz undercard. This time they meet on neutral ground in Los Angeles. Juarez once surprisingly stuck with Marco Antonio Barrera and in the rematch, was outboxed and frustrated, losing pretty convincingly. I think the same might well happen here, but once Rocky let his hands go against John, he got him in some trouble. If Juarez -- for once in his career -- comes out ready to throw and put the pressure on, he could dethrone John as the world's #1 featherweight.
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I think the Cotto/Clottey fight will be good but I think that Cotto is just flat out better than him.
Victor Ortiz has a big step in my opinion and is facing someone who will not be a walk over.
John/Juarez… I think it will be a route for John. There was talk that John was sick coming up to the fight with Juarez in his home town. I am not John’s biggest fan but he proved that he is world class. Juarez just doesn’t have the ability to be elite appears. In order to be elite you must be able to win fights that you aren’t supposed to.
Last fight… and is the most significant at least in my eyes and the sport of boxing. The heavyweight title is the title that everyone should look at, but its glory has fallen. Haye might be pure hype but he does have the skills to pose a problems to the best heavyweight in the world. Both figthers have questionable chins… and that makes for must see TV esp when you consider the scope of the heavyweight division.
"Boxing is dirty," said Casamayor. " The day I’m not ready to be a dirty fighter is the day I don’t fight anymore because it will mean that I have no heart for it anymore."
i picked cotto/clotty
with the haye fight a close second.
i gave the cotto fight the nod because the haye/wlad fight can be a major, major dispointment and quite possible not last into the 3rd round.
cotto and clotty are going to beat the hell out of eachother, i think its got the potential to be fight of the year. i’ve liked clotty big in this fight since it was announced and still do. i think hes going to ko cotto.
john/juarez will be good. but john i think dominates this one and take a ud. he had a real off day the in previous fight.
Do you realize when was the last time Clottey has gotten a KO vs someone who is actually good?
"Boxing is dirty," said Casamayor. " The day I’m not ready to be a dirty fighter is the day I don’t fight anymore because it will mean that I have no heart for it anymore."
always forget to hit reply.
below post is my reply.
by sonofapsycho on May 29, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Seems unlikely to me
Clottey doesn’t knock guys out, and he tends to fade late in fights.
I went with Haye-Klitschko.
For those in NYC, I might try to watch that one at the Ukranian bar, if anyone’s down for that. I’ll need to hold my tongue (since I’m rooting for Haye), but I imagine it will be a crazy atmosphere.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
i'm seeing a replay of the plasterhands fights
i think cotto is going to fade late and the accumulation of clotty shots is going to be his downfall.
if he gets ko or not, i still like clotty to win
by sonofapsycho on May 29, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm down
Let’s meet up and watch it
Boxing writer: "Iran, what are you going to do when you retire?"
Iran Barkley: "Rob your house"
I'm down too
I actually like that bar and its whole vibe. I think the last time I was there, Ice had suckered me into taking a Tango lesson in the community center. I got there about an hour too early and got shitty drunk at the bar with a couple of old mean-looking Ukes. The dancing instructor practically threw me out of the class.
I really wonder if it will have the atmosphere we think it will…. what if we are the only boxing fans that show up?
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
I'll walk by and check
Usually they advertise (in Russian) for whenever Klitschko fights
Vogt early, Vogt often.
You need world class power to stop Cotto.
Common… we saw him get past Mosley who has world class power at welterweight, and Margarito who has world class power with loaded gloves. I just don’t see a stoppage.
"Boxing is dirty," said Casamayor. " The day I’m not ready to be a dirty fighter is the day I don’t fight anymore because it will mean that I have no heart for it anymore."
I feel like Clottey is a reprint of Azuhmah Nelson…. and there are far worse molds to be sculpted from. My early feeling is that Clottey doesn’t have what it takes to stop Cotto, but that he has what it takes to beat him.
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
He didn't 'get past' Margarito though?
And to be honest, I don’t go along with the ’let’s just assume he was guilty’ thing. Whatever happened to reasonable doubt? The more I read on the whole thing, the more I don’t like it. I’ll write it up another day, when I have less other stuff to do, but there are several things that don’t seem to add up in my opinion.
Anyway, as far as your post goes, Cotto did not ‘get past’ Margarito (any speculation as to whether he would or would not have done had Margarito been/not been wearing loaded wraps is largely redundant, since you have included it, and its implications, in your post anyway), although he did get past Mosley in convincing fashion.
I think the Cotto/Clottey fight will be a fairly one-sided fight, as Clottey, while a very good fighter with good physical attributes and a more than fair amount of heart and skill, will not be able to bully Cotto as he bullied Judah, and will fade late when the accumulation of body shots eventually catches up with him. I see a late TKO for Cotto.
I went for Haye/Klitschko. I am desperate to see Haye win, but I think Wlad is too big, too strong, and has rid himself of the tendency to hang the chin out for everyone bar the postman to have a swing at. The jab will demoralise Haye, but the big right over the top, when it lands, will be too much for him in my opinion. I hate being wrong, but I’d really and truly love to be on this occasion.
Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)
There is more reason to doubt Margarito’s greatness than there is to have faith in his hard earned achievements. He has only himself to blame for people doubting him. It isn’t like I am some PR fanboy….
There are certain things that a fighter should never do… and Margarito tried and most likely has done it. He broke the sanctity of the sport and for that I will never forgive him.
"Boxing is dirty," said Casamayor. " The day I’m not ready to be a dirty fighter is the day I don’t fight anymore because it will mean that I have no heart for it anymore."
Let's just assume he's guilty
Reviewing that fight, his wraps looked a mile high during the post-fight interview. If he ever fights again, he would have to pull a Dempsey and have his fists wrapped in the ring.
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
Just out of interest, did you ever fight?
Or are you, like my best friend, simply a fan?
Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)
I fought Silver Gloves, at 132lbs. Not that it makes a damn bit of difference. I’m not going to claim that it somehow makes me more knowledgable than anyone else here, if that is what you are driving at. I certainly have never had my hands wrapped with plaster-of-paris agents… so no, I don’t know for certain that I would feel it in a six foot wrap. I strongly suspect that I would, though, particularly if there were hardened pieces present.
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
I wasn't trying to trivialise you, or anything like that.
That is why I mentioned my best mate having never fought, I still respect his opinion just as much as anyone else’s.
I was just going to make the point that when I used to fight, there was no way in the world that I would want anything hard in my wraps. It would have completely F***ed up my hands if I had anything harder than wraps inside the glove. Especially if those ‘pieces’ or ‘fragments’ or whatever they were, were irregular in shape, as I’d expect plaster to be. I’d fully expect my hands to be irreparably screwed if I went 12 rounds with anything in my wraps, even the slightest digging in would carve you up beyond belief over any kind of distance, especially in the case of a man (like Margarito) who throws over 1000 punches a fight. I’ve seen Margarito’s hands (footage, anyway) since the Cotto and Mosley fights, and there is no scarring that would indicate the sort of stuff people are talking about.
The whole thing doesn’t make sense to me. When people discuss forensics, to state that there are ‘traces’ of something indicates very small,almost infinitesimal amounts. “Traces of semen”, “traces of blood”, etc etc. It’s never a bucketful, or even close. All the talk was that ‘traces’ of two different chemicals were found on Margarito’s hand-wraps, and that these two chemicals can be used in the making of plaster of paris. You need other stuff too, though, and the other stuff wasn’t present.
Also, you have the timing issue. If you fought yourself, you know that timing on the punch, ie- when the arm tenses on contact, and the angle and speed that goes with that, is everything. Punching with a glove on kills a lot of people’s timing. To effect it by 5% would be more than enough to make sure you would never catch a world class fighter properly, or at least not in the same way. So the theory goes, Toni just sticks some plaster in his gloves for the fights. It can’t happen that way. If you are used to throwing shots a certain way, and timing them a certain way, then the adding of another factor for a one-off occasion would be a really bad move, as it would throw you off and make you less effective, not more so. And Toni can’t be training full-time with rocks in his gloves, he would have ground down his bones in his hands to dust by now, and the scarring would be incredible AND clearly visible.
The other interesting thing for me was that there was apparently some plaster inside his hand- ie- on the palm. This was never illegal in any fight I had, in fact I used to hold a little tube of 12 or so pipe cleaners in my hands, as gripping something made my wrists more tense (try it yourself!!) , and I felt I got more power that way. It wasn’t illegal in my fights, so is it safe to assume that it isn’t at that level either? I’m not sure on this one, but I do know that haviug plaster inside your palm will not cause any damage to your opponent, any more than a fist will without it.
I know that this post will not go down well, and that a lot of people will probably raise merry hell with me for suggesting that there is more to this than one man cheating. The truth is, I do think there is more to this than one man cheating. There are too many irregularities, and too many things that don’t make sense in my mind.
Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)
The most intriguing fight has to be Haye's first Heavyweight test
I mean the others are good fights but if you wanna use the word “interesting”, it’s gotta be Haye
rocky – john fight is more interesting to me. i’m a houston fanboy so i’ll support any of my houston homeys straight up
The Dude Abides
by battle axe of doom on May 30, 2009 1:34 AM EDT reply actions
Klitchsko fight
because its been entirely too long since a egotistical loud-mouth died in the ring
Gimme 1 round!
To Clairfy
I don’t really wish death upon Haye. But I do wish to see the Klits absolute take his head off to the point where he’s never the same. So… That might actually be worse to see them Ali him… But I wanna see him get pounded into Bolivian one way or the other.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 30, 2009 1:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Klitschko-Haye
A last a HW fight worth watching instead of all this Valuev-Chagaev-Ruiz shit.
Rooting for Haye i would love it if he can find Wlads chin.
Cotto-Clottey is a cracking match up too. I fancy Cotto.
"..so try and listen hard before you fall in the trap, of making war, over a baseball cap" - Faithless
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