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Pacquiao v. Mayweather: Who's the best right now?

To me, this isn't a debate, and I'll explain why: Floyd Mayweather Jr. has yet to fight in this comeback of his, so I didn't rank him in the latest Bad Left Hook P4P Top 20 update. When asked in the comments where I'd have put him had I put him in, I said No. 2. I'd thought about it, but decided the best course was to wait until we see how he looks in July.

But it is an interesting topic. Let's say -- y'know, for the sake of argument -- that Mayweather was never actually retired and simply on a year-plus sabbatical from active participation. I'd have dropped him out of the top 20 earlier this year anyway, but that is neither here nor there.

Who's got the best case now? Let's take a look.

Mayweather-hatton_medium

Five Best Opponents/Wins

Floyd Mayweather Jr.

1. Jose Luis Castillo (April 2002 / December 2002)

I truly feel that at the time they met, Castillo was Mayweather's best opponent, and the fact that the rugged brawler was Floyd's toughest win backs that up. Some even argue Castillo won the first fight, though I do not.

2. Oscar de la Hoya (May 2007)

Some might not put an aging Oscar this high. I do, and it's for a simple reason that I don't feel gets enough credit: Mayweather had no business fighting as a junior middleweight. I feel the fight was pretty close; I scored it a draw at the time, having rewatched it I had it 115-113 or 116-112 Mayweather. Oscar beat himself in this fight, and the size was a clear trouble for Floyd. The fact that he won fighting that high is pretty significant.

3. Diego Corrales (January 2001)

Corrales was 33-0 going into this fight and Mayweather took him to the woodshed. It was the most pronounced domination of his career. Corrales couldn't do anything against Floyd.

4. Genaro Hernandez (October 1998)

Somewhat of a forgotten Floyd win, since he's beaten names more familiar to American fans like Arturo Gatti, Jesus Chavez, Zab Judah, and even Chop-Chop Corley. Hernandez was a huge junior lightweight at 5'11" with a 72" reach. Mayweather dominated him for eight rounds, Hernandez quit, and he never fought again. Hernandez's only other career loss came to Oscar de la Hoya at lightweight in 1995, when Oscar forced him to retire after six rounds. But Genaro beat a lot of good fighters (Jorge Paez, Azumah Nelson, Carlos Hernandez, Raul Perez, etc.) and retired for medical reasons. It was a really good win for young Floyd.

5. Ricky Hatton (December 2007)

Hatton was unbeaten. He didn't stay that way after Floyd knocked him silly in ten.

Box_a_marquez_pacquiao_580_medium Manny Pacquiao

1. Juan Manuel Marquez (March 2008)

Floyd hadn't yet officially "retired" (that came in the summer of '08), but as it turned out these two battled in March for what became pound-for-pound rule. Pacquiao edged out Marquez on the official scorecards in a thrilling fight that busted PPV records for fighters at this weight in the main event. Debate still goes on, but you can say the same about Floyd-Castillo I. The pair also met, of course, in their epic draw in May 2004.

2. Ricky Hatton (May 2009)

Say what you will about Hatton, and yes Floyd beat him first. But Floyd beat Ricky Hatton at 147 pounds, where we knew for a fact Hatton wasn't "himself." Pacquiao not only came to Hatton's "house" at 140, but he plastered him in two rounds and hurt him with just about everything he threw. What Pacquiao did to Hatton cannot be overstated.

3. Marco Antonio Barrera (November 2003 / October 2007)

The first win more than the second. In November '03, Pacquiao savagely routed Barrera until the Barrera corner finally stopped it in the 11th round. Marco Antonio was one of the world's best at that point, and Pacquiao pounded him ruthlessly. Their second fight wasn't the same; Barrera fought mostly to hang on, but I still had them both around the P4P top ten range at the time. Barrera had been excellent against Marquez seven months prior, but he didn't come out to beat Pacquiao so much as he came to be in the ring with Pacquiao and cash the check.

4. Erik Morales (January 2006 / November 2006)

Both of these wins are far bigger than the second Barrera win, and I debated in which order to put the two opponents, but it was the first MAB victory where we all went, "Whoa -- this guy is for real." Morales beat Pacquiao the first time they squared off, but Pacquiao beat the spirit from Morales in the rematch, and finished him off for all intents and purposes ten months later when he overwhelmed him inside of three rounds. The image of warrior Morales on his hindquarters, knowing there's nothing he can do, and shaking his head "no more" will always stay with me -- as will his classy raising of Pacquiao's hand after the fight.

5. Oscar de la Hoya (December 2008)

This was massive -- make no mistakes. This might also give you a spoiler idea on where we're headed. But it comes with the asterisk that Oscar flat-out was not healthy for this fight. Anyone will admit to that, even Freddie Roach. Still, going up in weight and not just beating a guy many thought would be physically too much for him, but putting him out to pasture with a one-sided whooping? That is special. Pacquiao matched pound-for-pound with dollar-for-dollar with this fight, it appears.

The Common Opponents: Oscar and Ricky

Oscar de la Hoya

Again: Floyd went up to 154 and edged out Oscar, who looked fit, strong, and comfortable that night, at least until Floyd took his jab away and/or Oscar couldn't figure out how to use the jab anymore and/or Oscar foolishly gave up the jab.

Manny, on the other hand, fought a drained, even older, even more of a part-time fighter when he fought Oscar. You cannot argue who beat the better Oscar de la Hoya, I don't think. It was Floyd.

Ricky Hatton

And on the flipside...

Hatton looked physically good against Manny. Says he felt great. He also was strong and in shape for Mayweather, but those seven pounds had already proven to be a lot for Ricky to give up. Hatton got Manny at his weight -- he was 44-0 there. And he was blown out. Manny takes this one with ease.

Manny's Losses

This one isn't hard to address, either: Outside of Morales, which was twice avenged, Manny's losses mean nothing. He was a young, 112-pound fighter who fought with one hand and had no defense. Today's Manny Pacquiao and the Pacquiao that was stopped by Rustico Torrecampos and Medgoen Singsurat aren't the same person.

The "Duck" Game

It doesn't mean a whole lot in terms of what they've done, but Pacquiao doesn't back down from challenges. His last two fights have been him going to other guys, and pretty good guys at that. Mayweather has long been accused of ducking the top welterweights, though again he did fight legit champion Carlos Baldomir, and his fight with Zab Judah had already been signed for April 2006 before Judah was shockingly upset by Baldomir in January. At welter, Mayweather fought Cinderella Man Baldomir, Judah and Hatton -- neither of whom are at their best at 147. There was Margarito, there was Cotto, there was Mosley, and he fought none of them, though to be fair most accounts I've read say that it was Mosley that backed out of possible negotiations for a fight with Mayweather at 147. It is what it is, and you can make of all the scuttlebutt what you wish, but I don't take a lot of it all that seriously.

The "Verdict"

I stick to what I've said recently in comments and just back-and-forth with folks here: Mayweather does not have Pacquiao's résumé anymore. While Floyd has been talking, Manny has been fighting and winning. As much as I think Mayweather doesn't get enough credit for some of the great things he's done from hardcore fans, I also don't think it matches what Pacquiao has done.

The difference is truly Marquez, Barrera and Morales -- when he beat these guys (at least the first times in the cases of the latter two) they were great fighters. Pacquiao beat them all, and he beat Barrera and Morales very convincingly.

Was Corrales ever really a great fighter? Was Hernandez? Was Oscar still great? Was Ricky great at 147? I don't want to slam any of them, but I say no on every count. I don't think Castillo was great, either. All of them were very, very good, save perhaps for Hatton, who I'd put at simply "pretty good" at 147, something even Hatton would agree with, I think.

They've both had several other notable wins, and I put their "extra credit" good wins about on par with one another.

There are a lot of ways to go about debating this, I believe. But for me, it's Manny Pacquiao, and it has nothing to do with the fact that I'd rather watch Manny fight than I would Floyd.

The best way to settle this would be for the two of them to meet, if and when Mayweather beats Marquez in July. That's the old-fashioned way. Let's get old-fashioned.

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I'll put my two cents in

I would easily put Floyd’s top 5 wins against Manny’s.

For one, I don’t think people remember the hype around these fighters when Floyd was facing them. I mean look at your list and you gotta notice something. There isn’t even mention of the Gatti fight. Floyd goes up against some serious hype and dismantles them to the point where they become damaged good.

Also, to me . . Manny’s wins against Morales and Barrera were very nice. But to me, Morales and Barrera were never great fighters. They were beating each other up the whole time while Manny got to sit there and watch for a bit. To me, Manny’s best victories were against Marquez and you could make an argument that he lost each fight just as much as he won each fight.

Don’t get me wrong. I love Manny. I think what he’s done for this sport since Floyd left is amazing. I also respect his determination to get better as we all have noticed over the last few years.

Pretty Boy Floyd Joy Money Mayweather Sinclair has in fact beaten every one of his fighters with ease. I know some would argue the Castillo and De La Hoya fights but those were handled with ease in my opinion as well.

Of course, I should remind anyone that this is just my opinion.

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 4:20 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

While Floyd is my favorite fighter

you can not say “he beat everyone of his fighters with ease” bc this is simple not true. Against DLH and Judah he was having serious problems at the beginning of both of those fights. He simple found a way to beat them. That is very different from handling them with ease. I have not seen the Castillo fight but if a fight is so close that it could go either way then I think by definition that fight was not handled with ease.

To be fair I think that Manny lost the second fight against JMM. And both Morales and Berrera where great fighters at the time they fought Manny.

by TXroyal on May 7, 2009 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The plan against Juddah was to let Judah start out fast

If you remember correctly. They knew he was a “Front Runner”.

De La Hoya? Come on. Seriously? I’ve watched that fight nearly 50 times and I still don’t get how the hell it was ruled so fucking close.

From the 5th round on, it was a masterpiece.

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gatti?

Did anyone seriously doubt that Floyd will kill a past-it Gatti (of course he would have killed a prime Gatti too)? I think SC’s list is much better off not including Gatti.

Morales and Barrera weren’t great? Now you’re trolling.

by Nick_ on May 7, 2009 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Kevin Iole had a throwaway line recently about Morales never being considered “an all-time great.”

And my thought was, “Y’know, he was at minimum one of the five best 122-pound fighters to ever live.”

Barrera and Morales are both Hall of Famers.

by SC on May 7, 2009 7:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry

There was a lot of hype at the time around Gatti, and Mayweather was only a 4-1 favorite. 4-1 isn’t saying it was close but it gave some props to Gatti. Giving him a punchers chance pretty much.

I also included it because of the way he won. It was simply beautiful.

As for Morales and Barrera, I know I’m few in this opinion but I never saw them as great fighters. I saw them as exciting fighters and really good fighters. Fighters that brought the best outta each other, but never great. Never Hall of Famers.

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

As for Morales and Barrera, I know I’m few in this opinion but I never saw them as great fighters. I saw them as exciting fighters and really good fighters. Fighters that brought the best outta each other, but never great. Never Hall of Famers.

You’re not just in the minority, you’re in the exceptionally vast minority. Both of them won titles in four weight classes and again, Morales is an ATG at 122, and Barrera is up there at 122 and 126.

by SC on May 7, 2009 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

*Hall of Famers in their prime

Chavez and Hamed don’t count in my book

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

WTF — OK, so you want to talk about Mayweather over Gatti because of “hype,” but Barrera over Hamed doesn’t matter? Hamed was one of the most hyped fighters on the planet, unbeaten, favored, and a damn sight better than Gatti.

Morales beat Daniel Zaragoza, Junior Jones, Wayne McCullough, Kevin Kelley, Chavez, Ayala, Carlos Hernandez, Barrera and Pacquiao, among others.

Barrera beat Morales, Hamed, Juarez twice, Ayala, Kelley, Peden, Fana (who remains a top 130 pounder, even though he’s not “great”), Kennedy McKinney, etc.

I mean who do you want them to have beaten? Seriously, they both fought just about everyone they could and more often than not they won.

by SC on May 7, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok well . . .

Now that you put it that way.

It made me think about it for a bit. I shouldn’t punish fighters because of the weak class around them.

Makes me think of the Klitschko brothers. It’s not their fault the Heavyweight division sucks right now.

As for the list of names you have mentioned though, I still don’t see one fighter there who was in his prime and is bound to make the Hall of Fame

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Zaragoza’s in the Hall, and I see three others: Morales, Barrera, and Pacquiao (and while I think Morales and Barrera should be locks, Pacquiao is now a flat-out no-brainer). I’m not picking, either. I also do believe Hamed has his own case, but if I had a vote he wouldn’t get mine.

by SC on May 7, 2009 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I see what you're saying

But my whole argument was them being in their prime whilst fighting.

Zaragoza is in but he fought Morales in his last fight. I also mentioned Morales and Barrera beating up on each other, yeah. And in my eyes, they fought Pacman before he hit his peak. You know, the time when he didn’t have much defense

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly… to say that 1st ballot hall of famers aren’t great is is beyond stupid to put it mildly.

"Boxing is dirty," said Casamayor. " The day I’m not ready to be a dirty fighter is the day I don’t fight anymore because it will mean that I have no heart for it anymore."

by Zocalo on May 7, 2009 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Only a 4 to 1 favorite? Thats a big favorite first off

and most people that know boxing would have put it closer to 10 to 1. Sometimes the oddsmakers slip up. Morales and Barrera are both HoF’ers. It will be a crime to everybody in the BHoF if Gatti ever is even considered. I don’t mind if he gets something ancillary from having his FotYs with Ward enshrined but as a boxer he does not belong. He was a tough bastard but about as talented as a club fighter.

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I couldnt believe it when Floyd actually fought Baldomir for an alphabelt

Then tried to claim he was a champion at 147. That guy has ducked most everybody he could.

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

well

The problem with this argument is that Baldomir was THE CHAMPION at 147 pounds. Sorry, dude, but he was the lineal champion by way of beating Judah. It wasn’t just for an alphabet.

by SC on May 7, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Judah was always incredibly overrated as well

Everybody and their mother knew the real meat of the division was Cotto, Margarito, Williams and Mosley

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

that's great

But Floyd said he was the champion because he was the champion. Baldomir beat Judah, Mayweather beat Baldomir. Williams also wasn’t in the argument at the time, really.

by SC on May 7, 2009 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hell Clottey would absolutely

CRUSH Judah.

I think Hatton has beaten better competition at 147 than Mayweather

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah but Clottey fought Judah and DIDN’T crush him. He beat him, but it was pretty close when it got stopped on the cut.

by SC on May 7, 2009 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

*Did*

absolutely crush judah typo

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I had Clottey at least 3 rounds ahead

And Clottey is a strong finisher. He would have won 9 of 12 rounds

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No doubt Clottey beats Judah, same reason (kinda) that you stated: Zab has no guts and leaves fights after six rounds. But I don’t think he quite crushed Zab.

by SC on May 7, 2009 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well I seem to score fights different than many

I had Sam Peter winning 8 rounds against Toney in their first fight

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

so fair nuf

on that account

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, well, me too. Preachin’ to the choir on that one.

by SC on May 7, 2009 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

My list of guys better than Judah

Not to be a dick to him cause I don’t think he’s a bad personality for boxing – just overrated.

Mosley
Tall Paul
Cotto
Cintron
Clottey
Berto
Callazo
(alot of C’s in this division I just noticed)
Margarito minus his loaded gloves? maybe

I think Judah is right on par with Carlos Quintana

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

and now that I think of it

I think Judah vs Quintana would be an excellent scrap and perfect for JMM vs Mayweather undercard. Relevant good fight without too much money going out the door.

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

(And just for the record)

Boxrec is listing Judah as fighting July 18th. Lol I’m fuckin genius.

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cintron? Really? He buckles against anyone good. He’s Puerto Rican Judah. The rest I agree with.

by SC on May 7, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think he's a natural 147 who doesn't seem to carry his power up in weight

And hes had to deal with getting beaten out of that division with loaded gloves once if not twice. Lets see how he does from this point on.

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He’s a whiner. He just doesn’t have the guts to be a top fighter. I also don’t think his power is what it appears to be. He’s still never stopped anyone very good.

by SC on May 7, 2009 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think he's a wait and see guy

He’s lost only to margarito and drew with a guy who’s only loss is to Margarito

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That draw was bullshit, though. I mean really. Martinez clearly beat him and knocked him down to boot, even though Cintron complained that Martinez hit him with a steel chair.

by SC on May 7, 2009 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly

Martinez certainly won that fight

by Full Throttle on May 8, 2009 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just a quick point on Cintron’s power:

Kurt Emhoff (Dmitriy Salita’s manager/lawyer) said recently over at No Mas that Cintron once dropped B-Hop in sparring. Crazy, no?

by Nick_ on May 8, 2009 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That is pretty nuts

But not totally surprising

by Option27 on May 8, 2009 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok Ok Ok

Gatti was an exciting fighter and had a lot of hype/hope going with him going up against Floyd. But my argument lied in the way Floyd did it to him.

It was beautiful

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 11:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Absolutely. I’ve always preferred Floyd-Chico to Floyd-Gatti as far as Floyd demolitions go, but they’re the same story: Tough, gritty guy broken to pieces by a world class boxer that toyed with them.

by SC on May 7, 2009 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Morales and Barrera aren’t great fighters but you want to pimp Gatti? Woah…

"Boxing is dirty," said Casamayor. " The day I’m not ready to be a dirty fighter is the day I don’t fight anymore because it will mean that I have no heart for it anymore."

by Zocalo on May 7, 2009 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Aye aye aye

I don’t even think Gatti is a Hall of Famer.

That one was mainly because of the hype and the way the fight went down.

It was just a really nice “notable” fight for me to watch

by Option27 on May 7, 2009 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gatti shouldn't be allowed to be put in the same sentence as Hall of Fame

Unless its to say… had the rest of Gatti’s career been as good as his fights against Ward… He might deserve to be there.

Gimme 1 round!

by ItBurnzWhenIP on May 7, 2009 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Read what I said… then comment please.

"Boxing is dirty," said Casamayor. " The day I’m not ready to be a dirty fighter is the day I don’t fight anymore because it will mean that I have no heart for it anymore."

by Zocalo on May 8, 2009 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Everybody dismantled Gatti.

“Pretty Boy Floyd has in fact beaten every one of his fighters with ease”. Did you see the Castillo fight? It’s less clear that he won that fight than it is that Manny beat Marquez in the second fight.

I think Floyd’s gotta beat Manny to have the better ATG status, and I don’t Floyd’s got the stomach for that war. Everything about Floyd is ‘safe’, and there’s nothing safe and secure about fighting Manny. Even if he thinks he’ll knock out Manny, Floyd knows Manny is reckless and seemingly fearless and Floyd’s neither of those.

by lcollins1 on May 9, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

to quote freddie roach from the newest edition of SI

“manny would be the shit out [mayweather]”

The Dude Abides

by battle axe of doom on May 7, 2009 7:49 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I remember a while back Scott when you still had the old version of the site you asked me to vote on the top twenty and write a few words on my picks… I think it was after right Floyd signed to fight Hatton, but before he beat him. I can’t find what I wrote right now, but I know that I had Manny #1 and Floyd #2, and I think I was the only guy who voted who had it that way. My reasoning was that while it was an interesting acheivement from a historical standpoint, the Oscar fight was a bad fight that didn’t prove to me much about Mayweather that I didn’t already know. I didn’t drop as some kind of “punishment” or whatever, but just because he wasn’t fighting very often, and the fights he was taking seemed fairly low-risk to me. Meanwhile Manny was on a tear, you know?

I don’t completely discard Manny’s own wins against Golden Boy and the Hitman, but I sort of see them the same way I saw Floyd’s. The obvious difference is the destructive one-sidedness, but a big part of that is because of Manny’s destructive style. Floyd dominated Hatton using his own style, and even though it took longer it was just as wide an outclassing I think. So I guess I pretty much throw all four wins out the window when I compare these two guys. Pacquiao has been in my number one slot for a good long while now, so of course Floyd coming back doesn’t change that for me.

"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb

by jrok on May 7, 2009 8:12 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

P4P Number one

Pacquiao

"One Shall Stand. One shall Fall" - Optimus Prime

by dinkman on May 8, 2009 8:18 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Resumes only...

On resumes only, I would go with Pacman. Barrera, Morales, Marquez, and Hatton says it all. If anybody thinks those guys arent HOF, then I don’t know what else to say.

As far as skills go, I’m still picking PBF barring some serious ring rust.

by erod on May 8, 2009 9:14 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Let's talk about on other aspects.

I’ve noticed some of the arguments above are mostly on about floyd’s opponents. We can easily tell that more questions can be poured on if he fought the best out there that he could ever find. But i think we can easily compare both on how the reached on top by cruising weight classes. Manny has cruised up 8 weight classes to get where he is now. That equates to having far more challenges that floyd has. It shows that he has more balls than floyds and brought out unending arguments on the ducking issue. Floyd can’t top those sh*t that manny went through cruising up to 8 weight divisions cause if he did, he should’ve fought in heavyweights.

by frogsOnTheLoose on May 8, 2009 12:42 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

wassup

i’m gonna try to disect this. mayweather truly has better boxing skilss than manny has for now. that’s not a question. but maybe money may has lost some of his fighter’s spirit by playing it safe since 2002. manny hasn’t, he has beaten his opponents so bad that almost each of them contemplated retirement or retired after they lost to manny. speed, they have both the same or manny has more because mayweather is older and just got out of a two-year retirement. defense- pbf has the best in the game. offense-manny can puch every three minutes of every round. punching power- manny has more because he can knock down a fighter with one punch and combined with his hand-speed, he can land more power punches thatn mayweather. boxing skills-mayweather is more fine-tuned at that. he is like a well choreographed dancer in the ring. footwork- they’re about the same. heart- manny has shown more heart and willing to trade punches with anyone. floyed is known to run around and frustrate his opponents,but it’s hard to run around from a fast punching demon like manny. you’re gonna have to fight him. improvement-floyd has been the same fighter since day one. manny hasnt he’s been improving since his second fight with marquez. he showed great offense with diaz; showed great defense against de la hoya and showed great power against hatton. timing and movement- manny’s movement is so hard to predict, you don’t see a pattern in his movement. combined with his speed fighters can’t anticipate a punch coming from manny. that’s why de la hoya and diaz couldn’t counter him. so when the bell rings between money and pacman, we’ll see great defense agaisnt great ofense. can’t wait to see it.

by jay78 on May 9, 2009 6:10 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

mindset

What fighters bring to the arena reflects their training, their experiences – their mindset.

Someone wrote that mayweather jr didn’t go all out against ODH for some reason – reason why ODH was not knocked out. Crap! He was not able coz that’s what he is! That’s his training – that’s his mindset. His intensity is all over his mouth and not on his boxing. ODH was not over the hill – just that he has mellowed and very much underestimated Pacquiao.
Point is – if gayweather has the same training and mindset – he is very much in trouble. Fighters learn from other fighters -metal sharpens metal – they wisen up thru sheer experience – it’s the interpretation of those data that will differ.

 Pacquiao who have tangled with Barrera, Morales, Marquez (hall of famers) with the guidance of Roach has become a better fighter. I see the same floyd over and over again. will it be the same floyd when he meets Pacquiao (if ever he meets Pacquiao)? Then i’ll pick Pacquiao to win.

Styles makes a fight they say. Yeah – I want the “pound your enemies out of their senses” style. After all this is boxing and not the 100 meter dash.

by Warlord on May 9, 2009 11:53 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I’m not sure Manny went all out against DLH. I think Pac could’ve put him away earlier than he did, but gave some measure of respect to the old man.

by lcollins1 on May 9, 2009 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mayweather, Gatti, etc.

Remember that Gatti’s boxing skills had radically improved leading up to the Mayweather fight. It made some fans guess that the bout might be somewhat competitive. However, it wasn’t even a contest.

Mayweather v. Delahoya was a joke. Two great champions get into the ring and not a scratch or bruise between them. Frankly, I think Mayweather had an off night.

Yes. I am an unabashed Mayweather fan. I believe him the greatest boxer of them all. His coming out was the systemaic dismantling of Angel Manfredy. Manfredy was technically sound and well-conditioned guy who was made to look like a complete amateur in that fight.

Manny is force with which to be reckoned. There is no doubting that. Mayweather’s ability to block, slip, and counter would put Manny off balance. Mayweather is a master of change up, as well. Even with Mayweather at 140, I’d call a decision for Floyd. He has too many skills.

Shlomo Leib

by ShlomoLeib on Jun 6, 2009 7:50 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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