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Has Hopkins still got too much for 'Bad' Chad?

The question has been brought up, in an article from SC, and the resulting comments, about who would be the more liekly victor in a match-up between Bernard Hopkins and Chad Dawson. Who is the dominant force at 175lbs, right now?

SC commented that, "Dawson is almost 20 years younger and has a far brighter future, but I think most everyone would pick the savvy Hopkins to beat him one-on-one still." (http://www.badlefthook.com/2009/8/10/983892/living-in-america-the-best-the-u-s#comments)...

In the article comments, BrianBrock refuted this claim, by speculating that Dawson would now beat Hopkins, possibly by UD.

This isn't about right or wrong, but I would like to canvas opinion on this, for curiosity's sake more than anything.

Poll
Who do you think would win a fight, at 175lbs, between Bernard Hopkins and Chad Dawson, if the fight were held in late October/early November of this year (ie- giving them both prep time, hypothetically)
Bernard 'The Executioner' Hopkins
41 votes
'Bad' Chad Dawson
28 votes

69 votes | Poll has closed

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Comment 15 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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I'd take Hopkins by close UD, maybe an MD...

But Dawson wouldn’t win the fight on any of my hypothetical cards…

Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)

by Chaos100 on Aug 10, 2009 4:06 PM EDT reply actions  

Boxing quote

Can’t remember the exact quote but it was during the Bradley-Campbell fight. “Fighters can go from ‘in their prime’ to ‘old and washed up’ in a split second.” I fear that is what will happen to B-hop especially given the long layoff at such a late stage in his career.

by Waldo Rastel on Aug 10, 2009 4:30 PM EDT reply actions  

It would be one fight too far

In his prime yes. At near 45, seriously?! Its even so far with the votes, so stand corrected on the majority view….I think too much is being made of Dawson being lackluster with the pointless Tarver rematch and Hopkins with Pavlik. Dawson is far better than he looked last time out.

We're all given some sort of skill in life. Mine just happens to be beating up on people. (Sugar Ray Leonard)

by BrianBrock on Aug 10, 2009 4:51 PM EDT reply actions  

I thought Johnson beat Dawson in their first fight....

And Hopkins didn’t just LOOK good against Pavlik, he fought on the front foot all night, and took Pavlik to Painsville. He was unexpectedly brilliant, and cost me money, but I was ALMOST glad…..

I thought a nice quote, from a Badlefthooker (sorry I don’t remember who), was, when someone said a while back something about Peak-Hopkins…

“You mean Hopkins isn’t still at his peak? Do you think someone ought to tell him?”

:)

Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)

by Chaos100 on Aug 10, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought it was obviously a close fight and Dawson’s biggest test, and he passed it well enough…

Hopkins looked brilliant against Pavlik, no doubt. But Pavlik was Oscar-like in how little he showed that night, and it’ll be a long time, if ever, Pavlik Pavlik fights at 170 again. And you can’t erase how the slowness, time-wasting and feigning injuries he pulled in the Calzaghe fight?!
I see the poll’s now 63-37 Dawson ;)

We're all given some sort of skill in life. Mine just happens to be beating up on people. (Sugar Ray Leonard)

by BrianBrock on Aug 11, 2009 2:48 AM EDT reply actions  

And now it's 20-18 in favor of 'Nard... :)

Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)

by Chaos100 on Aug 12, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

tide's officially turned hey...

dammit (head shaking)

We're all given some sort of skill in life. Mine just happens to be beating up on people. (Sugar Ray Leonard)

by BrianBrock on Aug 13, 2009 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

I set the poll to stop at the end of August;

But with Hopkins now 36-25 ahead, I wouldn’t expect the consensus to change that much.

As I said in the original post, this isn’t about right or wrong. You are perfectly entitled to think Dawson would be too young and hungry for Hopkins, just as I believe Hopkins is too experienced and nasty for Dawson.

Let’s put it this way, I would rather fight Dawson than Hopkins, simply because Dawson doesn’t offer anything you won’t get from a million other fighters in a million gyms across the world. OK, he is better at it than almost anyone in his weight class (some would argue that the ‘almost’ is redundant in that sentence), is more durable, hits harder, etc etc, but I wouldn’t honestly know where to start if I was fighting Hopkins. I’d know that to beat Dawson, you have to fight going sideways, moving to his right to put him in positions he doesn’t throw well from.

Dawson fights best when he is fighting people who move in straight lines (Adamek, Johnson, although I thought he lsot the fight with Johnson), and who give him that extra bit of time (making instinct/anticipation less of a prerequisite) to line up his shots. Hopkins would not allow him this, and would also not require it himself, as he can punch off the back foot, the front foot, can make shapes Dawson has never seen before, and is seemingly indestructible.

I’m not saying,or implying, for one minute that I could beat Chad Dawson, but at least I’d have some idea of where to start. With Hopkins, how do you predict what he is gonna do? How do you formulate a gameplan that will be effective? Pavlik’s gameplan was to force Hopkins onto the back foot. Pavlik justifiably assumed that he would be on a seek-and-destroy mission, chasing Hopkins down and throwing at will until ‘Nard tied him up. Hopkins, unpredictably, crazily, and brilliantly, decided (well, Nazim Richardson probably decided) to fight the whole fight going forwards, beating Pavlik to the punch, forcing Pavlik to fight in a way he couldn’t handle. Pavlik has never been a back foot fighter, and Hopkins showed what a good, well executed gameplan can do.

I know Dawson at 175 is a different proposition to Pavlik at 170, but I think Hopkins would find a similar weakness in Dawson, and would exploit it mercilessly.

To look at it another way, just for a second, although this is the bit where I can be accused of stupidity and maybe even bias, I think Dawson lost 3 fights ago to Johnson. I also believe that Hopkins won the fight with Calzaghe (my card 114-113 Hopkins), and the first fight with Taylor (I had the second one a draw).

Taking my own personal views on these fights into consideration, I have never seen Bernard Hopkins in a fight I thought he lost (although had Eastman actually come to fight, I thought he could/should have beaten Hopkins that night, Hopkins was out of sorts,looked slow and lethargic, and Eastman seemed reluctant to let his hands go).

I have watched 4 Chad Dawson fights, and think he lost one of them.

I know I’m not a judge, and I’m not any sort of ‘real’ authority, and I could well be wrong or even just in the minority, but I would be less than reasoned if I didn’t take my own views on prior fights into consideration when discussing a potential/hypothetical match-up.

Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)

by Chaos100 on Aug 20, 2009 8:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

I am,of course, being really dense;

I have seen Hopkins lose a fight once… to Roy Jones Jr…. in 1993.

I have never seen any footage of his first fight, if said footage even exists?

Watched a fair few of the others, though, and I have only once scored a fight against him. Crazy, when you think I didn’t even like Hopkins until a couple of years ago. I was scoring against my own bias, and he still never lost a fight on ym cards, except against the man I rate as the best fighter I’ve ever seen, in any weight class.

Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)

by Chaos100 on Aug 20, 2009 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

Always a good idea to count out Bernard Hopkins.

by Scott Christ on Aug 11, 2009 12:00 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

hey

I’m not doing that at all. He was the underdog against Pavlik and pulled that off, I just liked Dawson in the match-up and thought that he would be the guy more people would pick at this stage.

We're all given some sort of skill in life. Mine just happens to be beating up on people. (Sugar Ray Leonard)

by BrianBrock on Aug 11, 2009 12:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Let's put it this way;

If the fight happens any time in the next year, I’ll take Hopkins at anything over even money. :)

Not saying I’m right, but I just have a feeling Hop would be too crafty, too nasty and too experienced for Dawson.

Also, you can never count out the chances of Hopkins doing something unexpected, like fighting on the front foot for 12 rounds vs Pavlik, when Kelly was justifiably expecting to be chasing Hopkins around the ring all fight….

Boxing is the beginning of all sports. I'm willing to bet that the first sport was a man against another man in a fight. (Omar Epps)

by Chaos100 on Aug 11, 2009 2:00 PM EDT reply actions  

you Would be able to get over even money...

as I don’t think Hopkins would be the favorite, whatever happens….

Hopefully Chad can look more impressive against Johnson the second time around in a few months and you might not be so willing to bet against him then against Hopkins ;)

Pavlik was a middleweight fighting at 170, already having loooked less sharp at 164 in the rematch with Taylor. Dawson would be at his correct weight. Near even voting now, btw….a pick ’em ;)

We're all given some sort of skill in life. Mine just happens to be beating up on people. (Sugar Ray Leonard)

by BrianBrock on Aug 11, 2009 3:12 PM EDT reply actions  

Bernard is..

Still too crafty for anything Chad has seen. IMO Chad is a little bit soft mentally and, if Bernard fights like he did against Kelly, look out!!! BHOP by SD in this one folks.

by SmittytheCutman on Aug 11, 2009 10:10 PM EDT reply actions  

A good question...

While Chad is highly skilled and is considered the man to beat,The Executioner is a tactioner and his knowledge of the ring can give Chad trouble.I would say Chad if Bernard trades with him.

by killah27 on Sep 2, 2009 6:26 PM EDT reply actions  

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