Boxing Book Review: Mike Silver's 'Arc of Boxing'

Note: Mike Silver is a former boxing promoter and inspector with the New York State Athletic Commission whose many articles on boxing have appeared in the New York Times, Ring magazine, Boxing Monthly and ESPN and Seconds Out websites.

Thank you, p2w, for producing such an argument. Everything is subjective, but I’d entirely concur with you. Its a fantastic point, and one that is widely ignored.

"remember the good ol’ days when everyone in boxing was white?"

That is just plain hogwash. Back in the day, there were probably just as amny or more black fighters. Aficaiandos are color blind.

But in the sports where performance is more subjective (like boxing & baseball), every generation is crappier than the one the preceeded it (if you listen to the old guys tell it).

I don’t think it’s conscious bias, but it’s deep and pervasive and stupid just the same. (And especially irritating when coming, as it so often is, from Northern white liberals.) There’s a size bias thing too—the if-it’s-not-heavyweigh-it’s-not-any-good bias, which is ridiculous. And, re, they-never-gave-up-and-fought-much-harder-back-then bias, A., they didn’t any more so than today. Also an improvement of some importance, thanks to improved safety measures (Drs. ambulances, better doctoring), boxers no longer die in droves as they did then—and do today, but far less often. Snuff boxing is not for me, I’ll take a little safety first, please. I’m convinced it’s rose-colored glasses: I remember Graziano—I liked him—but there is no way he’d beat Marvin Hagler. He’d be lucky to live thru’ the bout against Marvin Hagler.

So many weight-classes and sanct.-bodies don´t mean, they are such good! It´s just a matter of earning money. So many people all over the world want to make so much money out of boxing. And earn money they should. But that don´t mean a thing.

I can´t excactly imagine the scene in USA, for I live in Germany. And here I see many meaningless belts, many meaningless champs. It´s all but inflation. Not only in boxing, but in everything. You can´t increase the value of one given thing just by increasing the number. You have to look at the quality! I follow boxing since my dad woke me up at night to watch the early Muhammad Ali (at this time: C.C.) fights, got active since the late 60s (and retired as the oldest Kickboxing-heavyweight-Champ of Germany in 1992, but my heart ever went with Boxing) and have to watch a constant decreasing of boxing-techinques in the duztends of gyms and clubs I´ve been training at or visiting ever since (I still do).

I read Mike´s book several times and I´ve to say, I´ve never read a better book about that subject of boxing in context of history. He has to get the Pulizer! It´s not a matter of liking his conclusions or not. You got to face the facts. Wether You like boxing or not (And I do, same as You do) And although a few things are a little bit hard articulated (Hopkins, or Hagler vs Graziano) for my very taste, in a scientific way, Mike is 100% right. Sometimes I can´t realize it, but Mike has really opened my eyes and now I konw what I´ve been missing in boxing through the last decades!

A quite a different thing is, my dearest boxing-mate, as You mentioned out of 11 lightweights 11 were from the USA and 10.5 were white. I didn´t noticed that before (color). It´s quite a good point and can be true. But it´s not Mike´s fault and doesn´t make today´s champs any better.

The real challenge behind the fats Mike has named is to stay with Boxing, through all the bad things of the past. Mafia, WBA, WBC, IBF, the damn inflation of alphabet-groups, all the (in Germany) so called experts on German tv, that are just actors, prostitutes, politicians, even short-time boxers aso. Most of them not being on this planet when I (and many real experts) got into this business. To love Boxing despite all this what I call provocations and examinations.

Sometimes it helps a lot, that I meet quite extraordinary people in Boxing (or on internet-sites)! Even if they live in the USA and I can´t meet them!

Please don´t blame me to reply half a day later due to the time difference!

So the technically inept Graziano, Fred Apostoli , the 5 ft 7 Zale, hard punching but technically poor and small( 5 ft 7) Ceferino Garcia who lost 3 outta 3 to Barney Ross , a welterweight , and Marcel Thil are genuises while Hopkins" is an ordinary talent……Maybe he would have been a main event club fighter in the small clubs,". LMAO To me the modern boxing era starts after WW2 . I have to agree with p2w to an extent. How can the 20s be a great era when Dempsey and Tunney drew the colour line ? Was Battling Siki an example of these incredibly skilled 20s fighters ? Ill examine Benny Leonard . Examine the records of the fighters that the so called greatest of all times lightweight Leonard fought in his comeback . It’s embarrassing. Examine the records of the fighters that he defended against Pinky Mitchell 11-2-3 , so much for the old timers being more experienced. Johnny Mendelsohn 10 – 2 . Leonard made 3 defences against Rocky Kansas who he beat easily each time . Why the third fight? He was involved in a bizarre fixed fight with Jack Britton , the 147 champ . He never defended against an hispanic or black fighter . I wont bore anyone by going further but these people that hold up the 20s and 30s as Boxings golden era are so wrong it isnt even funny. Cheers All.

I prefer a mixed bag of collected essays. But I did like Teddy Atlas’s book.

BoxAnne addressed the enlightened health precautions taken today.

Your reminding us of how far out in the sewer boxing has come since the Mob’s being marginalized is a very good point. Golden, in fact.

I might add that I believe Muhammed Ali, Joe Frazier, Larry Holmes, Tommy Hearns, Ray Leonard and Roberto Duran… just to name a few…would have eaten many old timers for breakfast.

South Africa had its own Jim Crow issues and its own Golden Age and seems to be coming back. Austrailia seems very strong as does the the U.K. Pinoy boxing has always been strong. Many of the AFrican countries are on the downswing. Eatsern Europe has exploded. It just varies and will change from decade to decade.

I want to get it and dog ear all the pages I felt were subpar and robbed me of my nickel.

Even for a hardcover book that price is ridiculous. I’ll check it out via the library.

I could not find this book for love nor money.

a great publisher which Silver has, you still have to pour a lot of your own money into the project. Believe me, it’s not easy, though I will say that wwriting a crime book is much more difficult—and also much more rewarding because the target market is so big.

The other thing is that thiss book is big. That is, the pages are bigger than your normal hardback.

All in all, I really can’t comment on the price other than to say there are ways to work the price down. Is it worth $ 44. I say it is.

He uses Hopkins to make this argument.

Leonard, Hearns, Ali….all of these guys were tremendous boxers and athletes.
In any time. They would box and/or knock the blocks off of many if not any of the greats. Any time.

And please let us not be so politically correct as to avoid race altogether. It is a huge factor. Black men had to be that much better than whiotes….to even be considered for a spot. That is testament to Jack Johnson, SRL and others. they had to be great. Otherwise, they were nothing more than fodder for promotion.

Once the golden Era ended…and Civil Rights were granted….black men dominated this and some other sports as if a dam had burst.

No Era is Golden when Jim Crow ruled.
Unless you like asterisks.
Which I don’t!

That’s ridiculous. It’s patently ridiculous. It’s clouded, biased judgment, it’s lazy, and it’s … well, stupid. The same as saying Bernard Hopkins would only have been a club fighter in the “Golden Age.” You can have as many facts — legitimate or twisted — as you want, but frankly I refuse to be convinced by any argument as silly or irrational as one of those, no matter how articulately or passionately stated. I wouldn’t really need a debate, nor desire one with someone who thinks along those lines, because there’s nothing to debate. Sugar Ray Leonard was, to put it mildly, a “good fighter.” Bernard Hopkins would have fared well, or better than that, in any era. It’s sensationalistic, willful ignorance and combativeness to suggest otherwise, IMO. If someone wants to believe in these things, fine, but it’s wrong and as much of a waste of my time “debating” it as if someone was arguing, “You know who wasn’t that good? Sugar Ray Robinson. I mean give me a break!”

I’ve been through these “old v. new” pseudo-debates with baseball before, where there is still a giant collective of fraidy-cat oldsters who are terrified by the idea that maybe, just maybe, nostalgia is clouding their judgment and that not everything was better when they were in their childhood or adult prime. In my experience, it boils down to, “Well I don’t think that’s a rational way to think about this.” versus “YOU DON’T KNOW NOTHIN! THE SPORT IS MAGICAL AND PEAKED IN 1937 LIKE ALL THINGS! ALL YER NEWFANGLED STATS ARE HOGWASH. EVERYTHING NEW IS WORSE.”

It’s not for me, because I really have no desire to debate or discuss that. What’s the use? I chalk it up to what it is and move on.

What I know of Mike Silver, he is indeed an articulate, passionate writer, a very knowledgeable man, and simply from reading reviews of this book, he has his points about many things, such as the ABCs and the dilution of boxing on some levels. I will read this book someday, I’m sure, when it’s not $40. I need that $40 to order Latin Fury shows, because I still enjoy watching boxing.

serious dreams when these older guys fought.

unjust
i meant.

It’s very easy to know who’s from where. Margarito was born in Torrance, CA but lives and fights out of Tijuana. The Hattons were not born in Manchester, but they fight out of Manchester and have become icons for the city (well, Ricky has). This isn’t really important — if you connect with a fanbase, you connect with a fanbase. p2w was not saying there was some sort of conspiracy to list hometowns or “fighting out of” in a fraudulent fashion, just pointing out that all of the fights in his first list were American-based fighters, who fought in America almost exclusively, as opposed to the globalization of today.

“impotent,” as it is areal word.

My Life in Baseball was Cobb’s story, and he sort of … well, he embellished and pulled a lot of “Who me?” stuff. Get Cobb by Al Stump. That’s the real account of who Cobb really was, and a great, great book. I probably read it once a year or so.

exception. Cobb was good, but he was bad.

I try not to indicate who I don’t like, with medium success, but it’ easy to say who I like. One is Robert Mladinich who wrote one of the reviews. Another is Gordon Marino, a great mate, who writes for the WSJ. Jim Amato and Lee Groves are damn good. Frank Lotierzo is simply superb. Our own SC does some righteous work as well. There are others, but these quickly to come to mind. Mike Casey and I almsot started a Boxing Site together but he went off to pursue his art which is outstandiing. He can write a nice piece, though, in the true English tradition.. Why did you ask this question, anyway?

Margarito is a slow starter. Or at least he has been. Manny is the opposite. Throw in wicked fast and atlhletic and you can quickly find yourself behin 4 or 5 rounds down. If that pattern follows, it is fair to assume Margarito’s will as well. he will start to come on. A Pacquiao at less than peak condition will have 2/3 of the fight to fight off a late charge.

Here’s where Manny is different from Cotto, Clottey and Williams. He closes; fighting until the final bell sounds. No cruising. No deceleration. No gassing, His volume is constant. His pressure relentless. Cotto gasses. Clottey’s governor restricts his output. williams is inaccurate.

A prepared Manny takes the much much bigger Margarito apart. Anything less that his best…and it’s anyone’s guess.

If it were at 147, I go Manny inside the distance. Because it’s at 154, I think Toni will be too big for Pac to hurt too much, and I can see him (Margarito) going the distance in a lopsided decision loss.

 My impression is that hes got the wrong tools to fight a southpaw. I know he beat Sergio Martinez but was defeated by Daniel Santos . Old Roach is a genius at matching Pac with fighters who are left jab- hook dominant . Its no coincidence Marquez and Morales gave him great fights . They both have really good straight and overhand rights and both have good right uppercuts . Margos left uppercut will leave him exposed to Mannys left cross . Cheers Mate.

Cotto and Oscar are actually converted southpaws and Hatton has a much better jab and hook than a right hand .

Margarito has definitely got a better more natural right hand than the other 3 fighter I mentioned . I didnt realise that Ted . He looks so much fresher and younger in the face against Martinez. If it was that Margarito against Pac Id give him a 5o% shot . Not the current model though . Cheers Mate .