Dan Rafael discusses who Arum has in mind to fight Pacman
by missmanners on Mar 18, 2010 9:25 PM EDT
37 comments
In his latest blog, Dan Rafael discusses who Manny Pacquiao might fight next. In particular, he has been in contact with Arum, who thinks that Manny will fight in the fall regardless of how the elections go. Rafael writes that Arum has his eye(s) on three possible opponents:
• Antonio Margarito, the disgraced former welterweight titlist who Arum anticipates will eventually get his license back after having it revoked for trying to fight Mosley with loaded hand wraps 14 months ago.
• Edwin Valero, the former lightweight titlist who is moving up to junior welterweight for his next fight. Valero, who has had licensing issues because of a past medical problem, is licensed in Texas, so maybe we'll see a return to Jerry Jones' Cowboys Stadium if that fight is made.
• Juan Manuel Marquez, the lightweight champ who would have to move up in weight. Marquez and Pacquiao have fought two memorable battles with Pacquiao going 1-0-1 in two terrific and close fights in which both decisions were highly controversial. If there is Pacquiao-Marquez III it would mean Top Rank would have to work with Golden Boy, Marquez's promoter, which is always a dicey proposition.
I think that any of these fights would probably do worse than the Clottey fight in terms of casual fan interest or PPV buys. Valero is not well-known enough and Marquez looks shot after Mayweather, or at the very least, he should not be fighting at welterweight. I know that Arum loves to line his pockets, but this continual talk of Margarito sickens me. He was caught cheating and his first fight back would be a reward-a huge payday with Manny?
How do you feel about these three names? If fights with Floyd or Mosley can't, or won't happen, what other options are there for Manny?
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This is all hot air on Arum's part
but having said that, I wouldn’t fight Valero right now if I were Pac. That only has hard-core fan appeal and I think is a very dangerous fight.
There’s only one fight.
"Yes Gina, I am a Wise Cracker"
Valero would be a good fight
But also a massively one sided affair for Pacquiao. The other two are just silly really. I agree with collins that this is most likely just Arum talking a lot of rubbish.
I wouldn’t be suprised if Pac turned out to be the incredible hulk in a very good disguise. - Sigidy
There was an interview with Roach a few days ago
Where he was bringing up these names, but was extremely dismissive of Timothy Bradley, saying he isn’t a draw. I mean, say Bradley isn’t a draw with one breath and then say you want to fight Valero with the next? Last time I checked, Valero’s last fight was in front of 2,000 in Mexico in front of a crowd that was drawn by his opponent, while Bradley’s been drawing larger American crowds pretty regularly and has fought on US TV almost three times as much.
I think Marquez and Margarito are just god awful fights at this point, and I’m probably not interested in Valero unless it’s at 135. I can see where there’s some appeal to a third Marquez fight (even though Marquez would get obliterated at this point in his career – it would be like Pac-Terrible III), but I doubt GBP will even negotiate if the spectre of Mayweather-Pacquiao is hanging over their heads.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
" I know that Arum loves to line his pockets, but this continual talk of Margarito sickens me. He was caught cheating and his first fight back would be a reward-a huge payday with Manny?" Arum only thinks money; he has no integrity whatsoever—none.
"If you sit there and watch a person take about an hour to tie his shoestrings, then you realize that whatever problems you got ain't that significant"
---Vernon Forrest 2006
by The Midnight Rambler on Mar 19, 2010 9:42 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I would tend to think
(to hope) that Arum is blowing hot air as icollins says. No ego should stand in the way of a match-up with the winner of Mosley/Mayweather. Margarito would be a ridiculous choice, and I don’t picture a Marquez bout being competitive like their past fights were. A Valero bout would have a “shoot-out” interest going on, but seems more like a place-marker and interest building fight that one of the old-time champs would take before a major bout.
And Manny’s days left in the game don’t likely add up to the time for that.
The toughest fight is SSM; the best money fight is PBF. tHE OTHERS SUCK TO THE MAX.
"If you sit there and watch a person take about an hour to tie his shoestrings, then you realize that whatever problems you got ain't that significant"
---Vernon Forrest 2006
by The Midnight Rambler on Mar 19, 2010 9:44 AM EDT reply actions
Mosley isn't a realistic possibiliy
If he loses, then he lost. If he wins, then Mayweather has an immediate rematch clause. Plus he’s promoted by GBP, and GBP isn’t going to let their fighters face Pacquiao while Mayweather-Pacquiao is still legitimately on the table.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
Well
You forgot to mention the other possibility. Mayweather loses and “retires.” I know that’s a big stretch of the imagination for some…. Floyd retiring.
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
Or Floyd wins and retires
Another bold, starry-eyed prediction…
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
I think that's very likely actually
It wouldn’t be a bad plan from his point of view, especially if he makes Mosley look old and beats him handily.Then he can say he came back and beat the best Welterweight in the world, so why bother fighting Pacquiao?
Obviously I don’t agree with this at all but it seems like the sort of thing Floyd might do.
I wouldn’t be suprised if Pac turned out to be the incredible hulk in a very good disguise. - Sigidy
by Drunken cutman on Mar 19, 2010 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Or
Floyd retires before the fight—just to wait for the dust to settle a little more.
by Don From Prov on Mar 19, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
If Mosley loses
close and Manny beats Floyd (and wants one more fight). …
by Don From Prov on Mar 19, 2010 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I think it’s practically impossible that Manny or Shane will ever want another fight if either of them beat Floyd. They would gallop off into the sunset like Alan Fucking Ladd: “Come, back Shane!”
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
If no PBF or Mosley...
…then how about Paul Williams if he can move back down to welter?
Otherwise, clean up 140. Alot of good fighters down there….Valero, Bradley, Alexander, etc.
…then how about Paul Williams if he can move back down to welter?
They won’t fight Yuri Foreman at 154 and Paul Williams is about three inches taller than Foreman, has a much longer reach, and is a southpaw to boot. There is not a single solitary chance in hell that anyone at 147 is going to fight Paul Williams. Well, Mosley, but neither Manny nor Mayweather are getting near that guy.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
Agreed about 140
If he feels he has done enough at 147 then clearing up down there would mean a few exciting fights againt skilled guys with good futures. He may be able to walk away from 147 on the strength of his wins there already but I feel that if he doens’t first beat Mosley or Mayweather then this would be a shame.
I wouldn’t be suprised if Pac turned out to be the incredible hulk in a very good disguise. - Sigidy
by Drunken cutman on Mar 19, 2010 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Valero, Bradley, Alexander, etc.. OK, That’s good, erod.
"If you sit there and watch a person take about an hour to tie his shoestrings, then you realize that whatever problems you got ain't that significant"
---Vernon Forrest 2006
by The Midnight Rambler on Mar 19, 2010 10:57 AM EDT reply actions
Jokes
think Margarito looked slow vs shane and the first half against Cotto? Picture that vs Manny—-
A lot of action vs Valero. Blood lust would compel me to buy that one, but the outcome would be a joke.
vs JMM. Allow me to quote Howard Cosell…“No interest what-so-ever.”
I agree this is just posturing. Any of these would create a backlash against Manny.
If Manny fought Margoratzo and slaughtered him as expected, that would be a GIANT woody popper.
"If you sit there and watch a person take about an hour to tie his shoestrings, then you realize that whatever problems you got ain't that significant"
---Vernon Forrest 2006
by The Midnight Rambler on Mar 19, 2010 2:57 PM EDT reply actions
Ted, only if he put the rat in a wheelchair. Thinking of this cretin walking off into the sunset with giant bags of money is a hard image to take. Wheeling off would be slightly easier. And the way he keeps name-dropping Margarito makes me wonder how much the devil paid for Arum’s slimy soul. A nickel would be three cents too much.
"This fight'll be the nastiest thing you'll ever see. I been sober for six weeks, and that makes me vicious."
-- Randall 'Tex' Cobb
Roach has been pretty vocal in his criticism of Margarito. I can’t imagine he’d sign off on this fight. I think the only way it would happen is if Koncz or someone like that were to overrule him.
Really?
Last I heard, The Roach was letting The Rat into his gym, and letting him work out, and saying nice things about him, and considering showing up to his reinstatement hearing. Is Freddy talking out of the other side of his mouth now?
"I fought Sugar Ray so much, I’m surprised I’m not diabetic."
-- Jake LaMotta
So he is talking out of the other side of his mouth now. I figured he would do so eventually.
"I fought Sugar Ray so much, I’m surprised I’m not diabetic."
-- Jake LaMotta
Maybe. A more charitable reading would be that he believed Margarito at first because (as he said in the video) he likes Margarito and wanted to believe him, but after deliberating on the matter for a while, he gradually became persuaded that Margarito must have cheated. Maybe that’s wrong, but I don’t think it’s at all implausible. I have gone through similar things in my own life, when people I’ve liked have lied to me.
In any event, the video isn’t from “now,” it’s from the leadup to the Cotto fight. So however it was that Roach came to his current opinion, he did so several months ago, not recently.
A few months ago isn’t “recently?” Maybe for politicians it isn’t.
Roach should have known better than to let Margarito anywhere near his gym. I read an interview he did last year where he talked about Tony working out in his gym and saying “how good he looked”, and how he believed his laughably unbelievable story. I have a hard time believing Freddy is that much of a sucker.. I suppose its possible, but putting yourself within ten feet of this guy smacks to me of something different.
"I fought Sugar Ray so much, I’m surprised I’m not diabetic."
-- Jake LaMotta
Again, I think a possible distinction here is that, unlike you or me, Roach actually knows Margarito and apparently had a friendly personal relationship with him prior to the Cotto incident. It’s all well and good for us to be able to immediately denounce Margarito, but the fact is that it’s easy for us to do that because to us, Margarito is just a guy on TV, not a real person. People who actually know him are not in the same boat as us. What’s that Atticus Finch line? To understand a man you have to walk in his shoes? I think that yes, it is possible to be “that much of a sucker.” at least for a while, when someone you know has done something terrible. You see it practically every day on the evening news. Some guy will get arrested and his friends, neighbors, and co-workers will say they don’t believe it.
I guess you mean “up until the Mosley incident,” since Margarito was the the toast of the town after he beat Cotto. I don’t recall ever hearing about any personal friendship between them. Freddy has been all over the map with his public comments about the case, initially calling for a lifetime ban on ESPN, then claiming (during the Hatton-Pacquiao promotion) that he was going to try to help Tony get his license back. Then he flipped again, saying “someone in his gym made the mistake of letting Margarito in” and talking about lifetime bans again.
Then just a few weeks ago Freddy said of a potential Pacquiao-Margarito fight: "Margarito has no license. They said we could fight in Mexico but that’s not going to happen. That would be a real bad move for Manny Pacquiao to slap the commission in the face. I’m thinking about it and the number one contender in mind right now is Edwin Valero."
Yes, wouldn’t want to slap the commission in the face. Not exactly the sort of unflinching stance on despicable glove-loading that we need from Boxing’s public face. How about “we will never make a fight with Antonio Margarito, and neither should any fighter, promoter or manager who respects the game. Boxing is a dangerous sport as it without loading your gloves, and I am living proof.”
"I fought Sugar Ray so much, I’m surprised I’m not diabetic."
-- Jake LaMotta
[Shrugs] He’s saying he doesn’t want to fight Margarito. I’m not going to be quibble over whether or not he worded his statement strongly enough. As for the stuff that happened earlier at the gym, that’s consistent with what I’ve been saying all along. (And yes, I did mean the Mosley incident, my bad on that.)
I have no particular love for Roach. My point is that we don’t know what we don’t know. I do oppose Margarito and take a backseat to no one on that. But the proper object of that scorn in Margarito. I see little value to passing judgment on other people for not being scornful enough, just to make a point, unless it’s really clear that they’re being dishonest. Here, we don’t have enough information to read Roach’s mind. When it comes to Margarito, Roach shouldn’t be either attacked or excused, he should just be ignored, because he doesn’t matter.
There’s also another possibility: that Roach genuinely isn’t sure if Margarito cheated on purpose, and so has vacillated back and forth over time. That may seem gullible to you and me, but he isn’t the only boxing figure to entertain that possibility. Shane Mosley himself believes that Margarito was on the level and that it was all Capetillo’s fault, and he seems to believe it without any vacillation.
I have no reason to think Roach and Margarito are great friends or anything, but they’re both major boxing figures based out of Los Angeles, big on the gym scene, and I’m sure they knew each other. I would surmise that they saw each other as professional colleagues or something like that.
by taco pal on Mar 22, 2010 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Great post. Summed up my feelings exactly.
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
i always get a little angry whenever i read or hear that the JMM fights were “highly controversial”. “debatable”? yes. “controversial”? no. (i’m in the minority that thought pacman won both fights)
as for these three fights. none of these dudes are named mosley (still sticking to my mosley prediction), so none of these interest me much.
Texans 19-0 in 2010-2011 season PERIOD
by battle axe of doom on Mar 20, 2010 4:24 AM EDT reply actions
Mayweather beats Mosley with ease. Mayweather-Pacquiao doesn’t happen again over random blood testing. Mayweather gets the p4p crown. Then Pacquiao finally agrees to fight him because he wants the crown back. Mayweather wins 7 rounds to 5. That will be his next fight.
I agree
"If you sit there and watch a person take about an hour to tie his shoestrings, then you realize that whatever problems you got ain't that significant"
---Vernon Forrest 2006
by The Midnight Rambler on Mar 24, 2010 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Pacquiao will retire
Pacquiao will retire soon and nobody will get high payday anymore.. sorry but the opportunity to fight pacquiao is now closed. Mayweather is wasted
by Santino Damiracleboy on Mar 25, 2010 5:58 PM EDT reply actions
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