Who Has Turned a Stumbling Block into a Stepping Stone?
Andre Dirrell is talented enough, but is he tough enough? Andre Dirrell can be cute, but can he crush? Andre Dirrell has the slickness, but does he have the stamina? Those questions will be answered if he and his buddy ever decide on a location for their facin'. Though it seems clear, they would both like the whole thing to just go away...Anyway, the most important question for Dirrell to answer will be...Andre Dirrell is mannerly, but is he mailable?
But to his credit Dirrell really seemed to learn a lesson from the Froch F-up. He danced and when he got tired of dancing, he ran and when he got tired running, he flicked out some shots. He certainly frustrated Foch, but inadvertently frustrated those that begun the fight rooting for him, and all those who came to watch A fight. He left with the L for those reasons (and maybe a few more), but he turned the fight into fLight, so justifiably he got to take the extra L home with him.
Yes, he did seem to be gassing as Abraham was chasing in the 11th, so maybe he overshot it a bit. But he certainly earned some fans back. He gave out a one-sided beating and dominated an unbeaten fighter and the pre-tournament favorite.
That Froch F-up could be "that moment" the one that changes Dirrell from not enough to Sho'Nuff, The Last Dragon of the Super Six, if he really learned the lesson to, fight more, run less, be more aggressive, sit down on some punches.
Now Chad Dawson is fast, but is he ferocious? Chad Dawson is talented, but is he teachable? Yes, it may have seemed like Pascal might go down in the eleventh and, or maybe the 12th. The fight was closer than the announcers were making it out to be. But even if Chad KO's him in the 12th, people are still talking about how he kept letting Jean Pascal off the hook.
Chad tried to fight him safe and by doing so put himself in harms way of that gash from the clash. It wasn't shown on TV, but is Wladimir his new trainer? Baby bro fights like that for a reason. He's limited to two effective punches. But neither Klitschko would let an opponent off the hook that many times. It was all, catch and release, catch and release, when all the fans not sitting in the arena would have rather seen Chad, catch and bite the head off like Bear Grylls on Man vs Wild.
Saturday night was Chad's big "teachable moment." Will he grow like many believe Dirrell has? Or will he shrink like some previous unbeatens after being beaten, or stagnate like those who never become great?
As Michael Jordan showed the world, even he knew he had to grow. When his lack of a jump shot was exposed, he was willing to fix it. He became Jordan. Or conversely how Shaq has showed the world he was not willing to change. When his lack of free throw shooting was exposed, he felt what got him there was good enough.--- What boxers can be added to the list that have had that "teachable moment" in the ring. The one you watched or read about that propelled him into greater success, changed his career for the best? What fight did they learn that they had to change and what specifically did they change? Who turned a stumbling block into a stepping stone?
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Maybe Cintron
after two losses to a fighter that nobody wanted to fight (at the time) in Margarito.Now after beating Angula who is looking better every time he fights and with the allegations against Tony Cintron gets the benefeit of the doubt.He has turned the negatives into a postiive although he still needs a big name fighter on his resume !!! He should have lost to Martinez and was looking good against Williams but a Mosely or Cotto fight would turn the tide IMO !!!
It's not a matter of "IF" the North will break you.It's a matter of "WHEN" the North will break you.For up here every year counts as two on the outside.
by Ghostman (Son of the Wolf) on Aug 18, 2010 7:05 PM EDT reply actions
Could be...
but what is the lesson. What specificly do you believe he learned? can you spot that moment that a light may have come on.
Just off the top of my head, I might say that Cintron learned in the latter rounds of Margarito that things are going to go south, things are going to go against what we’ve planned in the gym. No fight is going to be perfect at that level, to win, I’m going to have to really push my limits of what I can take and be willing to dish. If Cintron is one to add to the list, it may be that he learned how deep his well can be. Maybe he learned it actually in the ring against Angula, kind of what it takes type of thing. But what would you say?
can you spot that moment that a light may have come on.
When Ronnie Shields took over as his trainer.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Aug 18, 2010 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions
LOL
“And can you pinpoint when the daylight began to spread?”
“Yeah, it was when the sun came up…..”
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
Freddie Roach
He developed Manny into an ambidextrous puncher after the Morales loss. He also changed Amir Khan into something. He sure knows how to learn lessons from setbacks.
Manny
I know manny took a loss or two early. I haven’t ever seen the early one. Have you seen it? Do you think his addition of Roach and the willingness to change was a direct result of that early loss? Or do you think it was just a natural progression from having signed on with Roach?
Highlight of the first one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9321Mo2Gags
I don’t think there’s more than that out there. That was way before Roach though. Unless I’m mistaken, he joined up with Roach around the time of the Ledabwa fight, which was after his first two losses. He did have the draw against Sanchez not long after they teamed up.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
Misread things a bit
I’m not 100% sure, but I think he ended up with Roach because he was a late replacement for the Ledabwa fight, and Roach was someone his then promoter recommended using when he went out to the US.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
Amir Khan
This one is a little obvious, but he deserves credit for at least realizing he needs to really protect his chin.
Boom that's exactly what I'm talking about
Since his KO loss against (Prescott????) He didn’t need much defense against Paulie, and I haven’t watched any of his other fights since the loss. As he steps up, it will prove true or untrue that he did learn that lesson and serve him well having learned it. Great one!
pacquiao hit early stumbling blocks when he was draining himself, and lost twice by KO. he then went on to dismember barrera, and “drew” (i thought he won period) JMM in their first fight. the GOAT met with another stumbling block in erik morales when he lost for the first time in 6 years. obv pacman went on to demolish morales twice, and is now the P4P king, and GOAT
Texans 19-0 in 2010-2011 season PERIOD
by battle axe of doom on Aug 18, 2010 11:54 PM EDT reply actions
Badmotorfinger rocks doom dude.
The mighty Soundgarden are back.
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
Manny
B. A. D. See my reply to Sick Frank and tell me what you think.
Are you serious?
I’m not asking to create a stir, I’m genuinely asking the question: Do you think Pacquaio is the greatest of all time?
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
Vladimir Klitschko
lost to Lamont Brewster and never looked back.
George Foreman. lost to Ali but grew as a man.
Wladimir
I would say his loss to Sanders was when he learned what seems to be his underlying stratagy, not to mix it up, not to make it a slugfest, and he has been unstoppable since. Just stay out, don’t gas, and pound them out from a distance. But that is a very good one either way.
Nigel Benn vs Michael Watson
After losing to Watson in London (TKO6), Benn relocated to Miami and hooked up with new trainer Vic Andreeti who calmed him down and taught him to fight more rhythmically. Benn learnt to feel his way with the jab and to defend himself properly. Picked up some quality sparring too; Freddie Pendleton taught him to stay cool and pick his shots; pace himself. And Benn started to listen.
Four fights later Benn lifted the WBO MW title from Doug DeWitt then defended against Iran Barkley, stopping him in one round.
Good fanpost John.
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
That's what I'm talking about
See, that’s why you’re a credit to this site. the knowledge and insight to hit it out of the park. Exactly what I was asking. I would never had know that. Now I do, I can research it a little and learn even more on it. From what you said, exactly the kind of steps I believe Dirrell can be capable of, to change, get better from one incident. great input!
Man, that’s too kind, but greatly appreciated. I agree, against Abraham, young Dirrell showed improved ring IQ and mental maturity.
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
Spot On
Benns still my favourite Pom fighter Goaty . The bloke was EXCITEMENT plus .
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. " Hunter S Thompson.
Bloody oath JC
Always wanted to see a Benn-Toney showdown or Benn-Julian Jackson – bombs away!
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
I've always fallen on the Eubank side of that divide....
I love the fact Eubank could take SO MUCH and just carry on regardless….
Some love their talented but ultimately flawed (or chinny) fighters, but I love the guys who can mix it with an artic and make it back down… :)
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
Haha! - Artic (articulated) = truck right Chaos?
Eubank’s eccentricity amped his toughness. “You sir have the audacity to believe you can stop ME?” – Preposterous!
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
Class!!
Yeah an artic = an articulated lorry.
Eubank vs an artic = Eubank in a narrow points decision.
Watson had Eubank in all sorts of trouble in the penultimate round of their fight. That was the only time I can think off the top of my head that I’’ve seen Eubank hurt. It still kind of makes my gut tighten up a little when I watch that, and see Eubank wobbling, bleeding, and still punching…. fills me with a kind of awe I can’t do justice to with written words.
I felt similar when Tua went down against Monte: I mean, it’s the only time Tua has been down, he was facing an alien experience, having to pick himself up off the floor, and when he got up he wasn’t just pulling himself up from a flash knockdown, he was really hurt! I mean, this was David Tua, and I was watching him wobble, legs unsteady, looking dazed…. that was a crazy moment for me as a fan. And you know why I love those guys and I give them so much more respect than I do the David Haye’s of the world? Because they went down, they were hurt, and when they got up they went FORWARD. No running, no attempt to hold, it reminds me of the way McIlvanney described Hagler/Hearns: “The more Hagler bled, the more likely it became that Hearns would be sacrificed.”
Amazing turn of phrase, and so apt. Eubank/Tua were bleeding, and they went forward to finish the other guy off. That, having been in the ring and also had, ahem.. a few ‘scrapes’ in the street, takes some massive balls. Tucking your chin in, pulling your hands up, ignoring the blood and going forward with bad intentions. It’s an amazing quality in a fighter, and probably the one I respect the most.
Jesus, this has practically become a fanpost!! :D
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
A minor correction:
Eubank was bleeding, Tua was just hurt.
Also, how I didn’t mention Maidana vs Ortiz as another recent example is beyond me…. :)
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
A fighter's fighter
Being hurt is like a primal trigger for some hey Rich – like a wounded animal – and a higher state of being than merely hiding the fact you’re hurt. In the toughest game of all walk a special breed.
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
Holmes
against Shavers , Snipes and Witherspoon . Let the tiger lose mate , Larry used to fire right up when he was on queer street .
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. " Hunter S Thompson.
It's a shame for Larry that he couldn't find that in him when he wasn't on queer street.
Holmes had the skills to be one of the most highly regarded heavies in the history of the sport, not just by us, the hardcore, but by the general public. Part of his problem was that he succeeded Ali, and therefore nothing he did would be good enough, but a lot of his problem wasn’t Ali, it was Holmes. If he’d opened up and gone to war, his record would probably still be pretty much the same. HIs legacy, and his bank balance, would probably be significantly different.
Yeah, exactly.
Most back down, some look to hold, some run. Others obviously simply capitulate. But being hurt, being dizzy, being cut and seeing your own blood cover you, and then walking forward instinctively in order to end the fight in your favour or go out on your shield…. it’s an amazing thing. It can’t be coached, and it can’t be coached out of a guy either in most cases. Since it’s instinctive, not the result of a conscious thought or compulsion, it is usually either there or it’s not.
And of all the guys in the sport I’ve ever seen, I love the guys who do that the best. The guys who simply refuse to back down.
Amen.
Maybe it’s too early to tell, but I think Miguel Cotto turned his horrible loss to Pacquiao into a stepping stone. Cotto has always been a very stubborn man… that’s why he clashed so much with Evangelista and why he chose to go with Santiago after he fired Evangelista: he basically thought he could train himself. But after the Pacquiao fight he finally realized he needed someone experienced in his corner and brought in Steward and was able to get accomplish three great things for his career: 1) he rebounded from a very tough loss, 2) he was able to earn his 4th title in three divisions and 3) he was able to, finally, take a belt from a champion (regardless of whether Foreman was a great champion or not, he finally accomplished it). And I believe the Pac fight was that turning point. It may be a little bit late, but better late than never, I think.
Officially boycotting Pacquiao vs. Margarito. In an economy that should be consumer driven, we suddenly find ourselves being force-fed by the producers of the spectacle. I say NO. If you agree with me, you should say NO too.
you and I tend to agree quite a bit, I’ve noticed
Officially boycotting Pacquiao vs. Margarito. In an economy that should be consumer driven, we suddenly find ourselves being force-fed by the producers of the spectacle. I say NO. If you agree with me, you should say NO too.
both great posters, IMO
I usually agree with both of you.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Aug 20, 2010 4:32 AM EDT up reply actions
not only that...
But I dare say, BoxAnne may have the very best screen name of anyone on BLH. I don’t even want to know if your real name is not really Roxanne. I’m just going to pretend that it is, it makes the screen name ever better…But Drunken Cutman is pretty good also, he might be the runner up.
Where is DC recently?
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
Pleasure sharing this space with you Suzanne.
You have real skills. Your timing, balance and ring knowledge are superb.
Bernard Hopkins
Some guys are the loser of the fight where two young exciting fighters come together and they disappear. What does Hopkins do? Dominates the middleweight division for 10 years after his 1st boring fight with Roy Jones Jr.
Hagler after the Antuofermo robbery was definitely a far more aggressive , meaner fighter . He wasnt going to sit back and box against Minter . Holyfield changed his body and style post the third Bowe fight . Joe Louis and his trainer Jack Blackburn working on Joe’s susceptibility to being caught with the right hand counter thrown over his jab ( see the first Schmeling fight ) . The post comeback Foreman had a new body and a new , less aggressive , smarter style to go with it , George really shortened his punches up as an old man . Lennox Lewis was like a prototype for Wlad K , like Wlad he was kayoed taking chances( against McCall) and became a much more methodical – safety first type fighter .
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. " Hunter S Thompson.
Great post mate
Hagler was some beast against Minter, ripped him to shreds. I’ll never forget that performance JC. “I’m getting meaner.”
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
He was my favourite nasty bastard.... :)
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
I want to say Angulo
He passed up a huge test with Sergio Martinez but has looked pretty good against lower tier competition.
Ray Leonard
learned the hard way in his first fight with Roberto Duran not to let your ego allow you abandon that which God has given you. In his case, natural strengths and ability to box.
Came back to outbox/fox Duran and force him to quit. Then went on, after falling behind, to notch his greatest triumph of all, against Tommy Hearns.
Yes, learned the hard way but what a testament to Leonard’s (at that point perhaps)underrated toughness. As you say, his p4p ego had something to prove and it cost him – but what a fight. One of my all-time faves along with the Hearns classic.
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
nice
nice eye, I would also go as far as to say, if he doesn’t get beat by Duran the first time. He gets his head ripped off when he moves up against Hagler. Whether he should have won that fight doesn’t matter here, what matters here is that the blueprint on how he had to change to fight Duran the second time, is almost how he fought Hagler. Fighting his fight, being patient, not being dragged into a war.
In the Legendary Nights episode for that fight, Leonard talks about how Hagler attempted to bait him into exchanges by taunting him. Leonard would just smile and say nope.
I don't think he was doing much smiling at the time...
although he did smile when he said it in Legendary Nights.
There was no way he wanted any part of Hagler in a real fight….
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
Recently how about Sergio Martinez
terrible decision draw to cintron when he won that fight not once but twice, questionable decision loss to williams (I think I gave it to williams, but it was close) and hten a solid victory over pavlik to be middleweight champion..
by journeyintosound on Aug 20, 2010 2:50 PM EDT reply actions
I don't know about that so much
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
Hopkins-Mercado?
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
Though I guess Hopkins-Jones was already mentioned
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
I think both are merited mentions.
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
John. That was an entertaining read.
I though about this and wondered if Pavliks stumbling block actually dropped him to the floor. Hopkins could have been his stepping stone followed by greater things… no so.
Also, what about Froch, let’s see if Kessler was his stumbling block. He’s currently still stumbling really and we don’t know how he’ll come back.
Terry Norris
KO’d by Julian Jackson but bounced back to knockout John Mugabi in one round four fights later to win the WBC title. I know his strength trainer put him on a regimented weight training program prior to the Mugabi fight, one that Norris stuck with for the duration of his career. He could bench something like 300 lbs.
A prime Terry Norris was some fighter – had it all – and a shaky chin just to keep it interesting..
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
Almost forgot about that one !!! Great example !!!
In fact I did forget !!!
It's not a matter of "IF" the North will break you.It's a matter of "WHEN" the North will break you.For up here every year counts as two on the outside.
by Ghostman (Son of the Wolf) on Aug 26, 2010 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Robert Guerrero
I was never high on him because he was often lackadaisical in the ring. Two things changed that, I think. First was when he lost to Orlando Salido (later changed to a NC), and the second was his wife getting cancer. Since then, he’s mostly fought with a renewed vigor and seems to have taken some major steps forward with his boxing and conditioning.
David Haye is another one. Knocked out by Carl Thompson, in part because he gassed out, he’s learned to pace himself a lot better and also takes protecting his chin a little more seriously.
Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."
... and not fighting anyone who can actually pose a threat.....
(aside from Mormeck… which I still think is his best win by far. On that note, any truth in the rumour Mormeck is fighting again, at heavyweight, and wants a Haye rematch?)
Now, Tweek, boxing is a Man sport. There is nothing in the world more Man than boxing. It is Man at his most Man. So when you spar with Ned here, just dig deep into that most Man part of you. (Uncle Jimbo, South Park: Tweek vs Craig)
Yeah, he wants to. He won’t, but he wants to. He looked like crap against Fres Oquendo, who didn’t look very good either. I had it for Oquendo. Story of his career.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Aug 21, 2010 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions
With a slightly reversed look at this,
Chris Eubank referred to his opponents as “a steeping stone who he must cross to reach his goal”. Stevie Collins ended up being his stumbling block.
by Phill on Aug 27, 2010 6:46 PM EDT via mobile reply actions

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