Couture deemed the experiment "silly," although he noted it would be the same if he tried to box. "James would probably knock me out in the first round."
--From Dan Wetzel's post-fight column at Yahoo! Sports
over 1 year ago
Scott Christ
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Gotta admire the honesty
"All the time he's boxing, he's thinking. All the time he was thinking, I was hitting him." - Jack Dempsey
And that's coming from the Armed Forces boxing champion from 1988 or something.
He understands he’s not anywhere near Toney’s boxing level.
If I was a hungry man with a gun in my hand and some promises to keep...
Did he actually box at that level in the army though
or not?
I’m just wondering because he doesn’t mention it in his book.
Good question.
I remember hearing it a few times that he was the Armed Forces boxing champ, but now I can’t find any confirmation.
May have just been hyperbole to hype him up, then. I’m not convinced he wasn’t, but there’s not much to support the claim at this point.
If I was a hungry man with a gun in my hand and some promises to keep...
He only did smokers in the army. He was never a Armed Forces champ let alone a Divisional champ. He may have been his company champ.
An unregulated, informal boxing match. I think the term comes from all the smoke in the bars where they were held.
Smokers in the army are fights put together by the soldiers’ company. Or unit vs. unit in some cases. There is no actual organization putting them together.
Well that certainly lines up with the lack of paperwork
supporting the broadcast crew’s assertions of championship.
At this point, if there’s any truth to the whole thing at all, it’s that during a smoker Couture beat a current/previous champion. Otherwise it’s all just crap.
Still, Couture is almost certainly the best dirty boxer in all of MMA. Hopefully someone surpasses him in the near future, since I think it’s the natural counter to a lot of clinch-work.
If I was a hungry man with a gun in my hand and some promises to keep...
In MMA
High level Mixed Martial Artist > Boxer
In Boxing
High level Boxer > Mixed Martial Artist
I don’t get what’s so complicated about that.
The interesting argument could come from comparing skills in Kickboxing, and even still that’s skewed against the Boxer against some guys.
by Patrick John McGreevy on Aug 29, 2010 2:44 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
One thing rang a little off in this column:
In MMA, where speed is a must, low body fat is imperative.
There’s no defending Toney’s conditioning, but the conditioning of MMA heavyweights generally seems much closer to Toney (or to be more on the nose, Fedor) than it does Couture/W. Klitschko. Toney’s expected lack of technique had much more to do with this loss than his (also-expected) lack of conditioning.
Speed is equally imperative in boxing. Please don’t talk down to the sport, Wetzel, even as your column still admits this event was a joke.
Also,
And while such a sideshow didn’t speak well for MMA, what does it say for the state of boxing, that a 42-year-old James Toney is someone’s heavyweight champion?
Yeah, that one’s just a slap-your-face-and-shut-up awful bit of argument, and Wetzel knows it. Calling an IBA champion an actual champion is like claiming you’re somebody because you bought an overpriced Who’s Who In America? guide. Poor.
Regardless of sport
Conditioning seems to just degrade with size. Couture would be faster than most, as he fights at 205, and just balloons up to heavyweight sometimes. Heavyweights, boxing or MMA, just seem to be in much worse shape, with certain exceptions of course
by Patrick John McGreevy on Aug 29, 2010 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed on both points
There are more out-of-condition fighters in MMA than in boxing. And there are also IBA-type factions in MMA that have champions that are complete jokes. This part of the Wetzel column is either poorly-written or disingenuous.
Did anyone watch this? If so, you would have heard Joe Rogan constantly calling this guy one of the greatest boxers of all time, in a way that would make me think Toney is the reigning P4P #1. No mention that he’s up 20 pounds from his last fight or question as to whether he did anything at all to prepare for this fight other than boxing… and eating… lots of eating.
"There are more out-of-condition fighters in MMA than in boxing."
At the highest levels? That is the most insane thing I’ve ever heard.
Follow me on Twitter: @MMANation.
I think the MMA guys tend to be more muscular/thicker set but they have to be for the wrestling side of things i suppose.
I wouldn’t say that top level MMA fighters are any better or any worse conditioned than top level boxers.
They are just more solidly built,imo,when you look at guys of the same weight from the two sports.
Boxers are usually about speed (apart from most heavies).MMA are quick but are more about core strength,imo.
Couture's a legend
Trains his ass off even though he’s facing an opponent with zero experience; enters the cage in phenomenal shape at 47. A credit to himself and combat sports.
"Anytime you go thirty rounds with a guy, try to kill each other, and have the utmost respect for each other, no one understands that, but guys who have been to war understand it." - Micky Ward on Arturo Gatti.
by Goatsnake on Aug 30, 2010 3:44 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
I have to honest and say I know eff all about Randy Coture,
But if I judged him on the above quote, I’d say he had more class in his little finger than JT could ever have. Fat bastard!
AND on the street the MMA fighter would kick the Boxers ass too !!!
And in a car,and on a train, and on a boat,and in the rain…
It's not a matter of "IF" the North will break you.It's a matter of "WHEN" the North will break you.For up here every year counts as two on the outside.
by Ghostman (Son of the Wolf) on Sep 2, 2010 6:10 AM EDT reply actions
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