Middleweight Update: Sergio Martinez-Nobuhiro Ishida, Dmitry Pirog-Peter Manfredo Jr. Discussed

by Scott Christ on Apr 12, 2011 7:33 PM EDT in Boxing News Analysis

With Nobuhiro Ishida entering the big-time talk due to Saturday's upset of James Kirkland, the middleweight division and champion Sergio Martinez are in the news, with Ishida attached, plus some other DiBella Entertainment middleweight talk.

The (Possible) Fight: Sergio Martinez v. Nobuhiro Ishida this fall
Source: Michael Marley @ BoxingScene.com

Thoughts: Well, if everyone's willing to take the 35-year-old Ishida (23-6-2, 8 KO) this seriously, you can't blame DiBella for looking for what is most likely an easy fight. Look, this is nothing against Ishida, who gave us all a shocker show on Saturday night by beating the crap out of Kirkland. It's just that on Saturday at 9:40pm EDT, no one would have been entertaining this thought. Hell, I don't think too many people who had a realistic perspective on Kirkland would have really thought Martinez-Kirkland was that good of a fight, and that's not hindsight. But this is just one fight that DiBella has submitted to HBO for approval, and to be fair to Ishida, he's been competitive in basically every loss of his career, and well, nobody expected him to tear through Kirkland, either.

Also worth noting: Erislandy Lara called out Ishida for a fight, which is either brassy or transparent, you decide.

The (Possible) Fight: Dmitry Pirog v. Peter Manfredo Jr. this summer/fall
Source: Chris LaBate @ BoxingScene.com

Thoughts: Pirog (18-0, 14 KO) had a few struggles with Argentina's Javier Maciel on March 26, not quite looking like the destroyer he appeared to be against Danny Jacobs. And that's boxing -- some nights, you look awesome, some nights you don't. Styles make fights and all that. He definitely won the fight against a game, determined opponent, and now he wants to fight in the States again. Manfredo (37-6, 20 KO) has gone on a six-fight win streak against middling opposition since getting obliterated by Sakio "The Hulk" Bika in November 2008, and the move back to middleweight has made him look stronger and just plain better. He's still not an A-list fighter by any means, but he's more credible than he sometimes gets credit for, and this wouldn't be the worst fight, especially if when you put all this together, you might be looking at a double-header with Martinez on top and Pirog-Manfredo in a co-feature, hopefully at that rate setting up Martinez-Pirog, or creating a different attractive matchup.

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Manfredo’s head is too static to stand a chance against Pirog.

by dervish686 on Apr 12, 2011 7:42 PM EDT reply actions

Would be surprised if HBO approved Ishida. They might go for Rubio (at least he’s somewhat of a name),and should be an easy payday for Martinez. .

by DPlainview on Apr 12, 2011 8:09 PM EDT reply actions

I'd have no problem with Rubio.

At least he’s a top-10 guy who’s faced legit opposition over the years.

by Verklemptomaniac on Apr 12, 2011 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions

I have no problem with Manfredo-Pirog. Martinez-Ishida would be a joke, with all due respect to Ishida. Ishida’s a regional fighter who had an excellent night against a fighter who was obviously completely off (his former) game.

by Verklemptomaniac on Apr 12, 2011 8:11 PM EDT reply actions

No and Yes to those fights.

Ishida is a solid fighter but nothing more then a top 20-30 guy. Doesn’t need to get into the ring with the best middleweight/fighter in the world. Manfredo is tough as hell and I think he would give Pirog a decent fight if it came to pass.

Also agree with Rubio. I was going to call him for the upset on FNF but the Internet swayed my opinion. He wouldn’t beat Martinez but like Verk said he has at least faced legit opponents over the year.

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by tylerrcurtis on Apr 12, 2011 8:19 PM EDT reply actions

I’d certainly be happy for Ishida, who would be in line for the best payday of his career, but he’s got no business in the ring with Maravilla.

Pirog…I think he might be good, but the guy’s best win is Danny Jacobs, who doesn’t strike me as special at all. Manfredo might have a real shot.

by The Boxer Rebellion on Apr 12, 2011 8:28 PM EDT via mobile reply actions

rubio vs martinez and manfredo vs pirog i think would be a solid double header for hbo. and id be more then happy to see lara v ishida on fnf’s main event. it is transparent what lara’s doing, but its also win-win. i think we’d all like to see ishida again. if lara wins he can get some of that shine ishida got from being the kirkland killer and take a step towards redeeming himself. if ishida wins hes a bonafide prospect killer/contender …

unless something better turns up, on paper i like those matchups…

by boxzilla on Apr 12, 2011 8:29 PM EDT reply actions

Probably the best scenario other than just going to Martinez-Pirog.

Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."

by Scott Christ on Apr 12, 2011 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions

hell, I'd take a Rubio-Manfredo co-feature

I think it’d be a decent fight and it’s no worse than Lee-McEwan, which would up being a good one anyway.

Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."

by Scott Christ on Apr 12, 2011 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions

I would have no complaints with that card. I think it would be a real entertaining night of fights. But at the same time before we see pirog take on martinez I would really like to get another look at him.

by boxzilla on Apr 12, 2011 9:07 PM EDT up reply actions

I'd rather not

In my head it’s still a moderately competitive fight. Another performance like Maciel and I doubt it stays that way.

Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."

by Scott Christ on Apr 12, 2011 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions

Not crazy about Martinez-Ishida at all, and while I hope that this just hot air, I am worried that it might actually get picked up by HBO. I kind of liked how HBO took a hard line with DiBella in making Martinez take on Dzinziruk last time around. Whether this is a sign they are actually committed to making more quality matches in the future or if instead it was more a case of having to fill a slot promised to Shaw in exchange for Bradley-Alexander is an open question. That being said, I thought they made one of the more compelling fights available around 154 and 160.

The problem however is that after turning down Zbik when he was Martinez’s mandatory and first choice for March, they immediately approved him as an opponent for Chavez Jr. in order to get back into Top Rank’s good graces. Beyond this, two of the hyped prospects being lined up for a future Martinez fight just went down this past weekend. Pirog, who may be the only logical opponent left actually willing to fight Martinez, has been completely neglected by American TV; while he would not have sold many tickets or attracted many viewers anyway, all of the momentum from the aftermath of the Jacobs fight has essentially been killed. These facts make me think that HBO might be more willing to pay Martinez for a gimme fight than they otherwise would have.

I imagine the other names on DiBella’s list are Manfredo, Rubio, and Lee, none of whom makes for the most compelling fight. I’m fine with Martinez taking a comparatively easy fight after the string of opponents he’s faced and while his trainer deals with his legal situation and I’m even fine with a stay-busy fight being picked up by HBO or Showtime, but if he fights only once more this year (as the pushing back of the date for his next fight seems to indicate), then this seems like a waste of everyone’s time.

by bachwards on Apr 12, 2011 10:14 PM EDT reply actions

The problem however is that after turning down Zbik when he was Martinez’s mandatory and first choice for March, they immediately approved him as an opponent for Chavez Jr. in order to get back into Top Rank’s good graces.

Well, that’s part of it. There’s also the absolute fact that Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. has a fanbase and will draw one of their better ratings this year for BAD. Or probably any show.

Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."

by Scott Christ on Apr 12, 2011 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions

I suppose so, but they’ve always refused to carry Chavez fights on network broadcasts in the past. I guess the Zbik fight is more meaningful since there’s a trinket on the line, but I think the decision was almost certainly motivated by losing Pacquiao-Mosley.

by bachwards on Apr 12, 2011 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions

I think there are a few angles here:

1. You’re right, “losing” Manny likely made them more apt to showcase Chavez. Word was that if Mayweather-Spadafora actually happens, HBO would be buying it because “they have no choice.”
2. Chavez is a guaranteed rating. His fanbase is very real.
3. Saul Alvarez-JCC Jr. is a possible mega-money fight at some point.
4. Chavez seems a bit more “legit” in Roach’s camp.
5. He generally puts on a decent fight.

Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."

by Scott Christ on Apr 12, 2011 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions

Admittedly I might be taking too much away from Rafael’s original story, as he made it sound like Greenburg, Davis, and Taffet all showed up at Donaire-Montiel in damage control mode to meet with Arum and agreed to the fight.

Also, on Alvarez-JCC Jr., I was under the impression that beyond the Golden Boy-Top Rank divide, the fact that Alvarez fights on Televisa and JCC Jr. on Azteca would make it practically impossible.

by bachwards on Apr 12, 2011 11:24 PM EDT reply actions

For now — but my guess is that Canelo is not going to stay with Golden Boy after his deal with them is up, as he’s a property all by himself. The Mexican TV situation would be another story and I’m certainly not terribly familiar with their deals there; how long they run, etc.

Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."

by Scott Christ on Apr 12, 2011 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions

I’m a bit confused … the fight says “Martinez vs. Manfredo” but everyone, including the article, seems to be talking about Martinez vs. Ishida. Is that a mistake?

Bob Arum would promote Lucifer himself if he could put asses in the seats.

by Apprentice on Apr 13, 2011 8:14 AM EDT reply actions