Mayweather vs Pacquiao: Floyd Confident He'd Win, Says Manny Makes Too Many Mistakes
by Scott Christ on Jan 19, 2012 12:20 PM EST
in Boxing News Analysis
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Rick Reeno of BoxingScene.com got a quick interview with Floyd Mayweather Jr, and the undefeated WBC welterweight titlist said (as you would expect) that he is ready to fight Manny Pacquiao on May 5, and also seems to believe Pacquiao is ready to fight on May 5, with only Bob Arum holding up the fight at this point. (Arum disputes this, and says he does want it, but hasn't responded to Mayweather's challenge to call Richard Schaefer or Al Haymon.)
Stylistically, Mayweather believes, as many do now, that he's simply too good for Pacquiao and will win if they do fight:
"He's pressure fighter but there are a lot of mistakes that he makes and you can't make those mistakes with Floyd Mayweather. If you make those mistakes, you have to pay. It's not that he hasn't earned the right to face Floyd Mayweather. It's just crazy that a guy can pop up out of nowhere and become such an amazing fighter, when a guy like me has been doing it since the 90s and dominating the sport and beating the best out there. And then a guy pops up out of nowhere and says he's on the level of a Floyd Mayweather when I've been dominating for almost 20 years now."
I do know what Mayweather is saying, and having this level of confidence and ego is a big part of why Floyd is as good as he is, but I do feel it's worth saying that Manny Pacquiao was also a very good fighter in the 1990s, winning a world title at flyweight.
Another thing I've never quite taken to or even really understood is the supposed disbelief of Pacquiao's improvements over the years. Is any of it really that surprising?
[ Related: Taiwan Animation of Pacquiao-Mayweather Negotiations ]
Yes, it's kind of a shock that he's become so great and such a major star, and the way he's traveled through weight classes winning big fights and title belts is pretty wild, but realistically, we're talking about a guy who came into boxing at 16 years of age from a background of incredible poverty. With his success in the sport, which at first came simply from big punching power and determination, he was able to improve his life and with it, his career.
He has learned from a fantastic teacher in Freddie Roach. He's become more than a one-handed brawler. He is not, as we have seen, a perfect fighter.
I don't mean to call Mayweather stupid or anything, because he's really not. But I don't think he quite understands or even attempts to understand where Manny Pacquiao came from. Though Mayweather was from a rough neighborhood and had a rocky upbringing, it doesn't compare to Pacquiao's childhood.
And while Pacquiao turned pro at 16, Mayweather was receiving exceptional boxing training from the time he was a toddler. Mayweather is a thoroughbred, born into the game and groomed to be great. What makes him so great is that he has the dedication to take advantage of both his physical gifts, and the gifts that come from being a second generation fighter who has had, in boxing, basically every advantage.
Mayweather was born and bred to be a great fighter. He was a standout amateur and an Olympian. Obviously, he has had a phenomenal pro career. Manny Pacquiao went into boxing with no such amateur background, without the benefit of great training and preparation. Manny Pacquiao took up fighting because he had to do something. The only thing the two of them have in common in their careers, really, is the determination to be great.
I think Mayweather misses all of this. He sees a guy like Pacquiao and wonders how it happened. And that's fair enough. The entire career path of Manny Pacquiao makes no sense to someone like Floyd Mayweather, I suppose. But I think the evidence that we have is very clear. It happened because Pacquiao did everything possible to make it happen.
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It’s amazing that a bloke known world-wide as a bit of a wanker can actually come out with a whole paragraph, in which there are no particularly wankerish statements, and just by referring to himself in the third person 3 times, make himself seem more of a wanker than he would have done had he just been his usual self
by whypunchrabbits? on Jan 19, 2012 12:33 PM EST reply actions
I think Floyd Joy’s main gripe isn’t how did Manny become great out of nowhere, but rather, how did Manny become more popular than Floyd despite Floyd having a more impressive record. I’d be peeved to if media portrays Manny as the best fighter (Even read some polls on GoogleBooks that said Manny is voted to be in the top 3 fighters to ever live, with Ali and Robinson.)
Floyd abdicated that honor by
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
'retiring'....not once but twice at critical moments in his career
In life, you make your breaks and you make decisions and choices. Some work. some don’t. Floyd rose to the top and to public consciousness when he acted out in creating a new persona in a new format of 24/7 prior to fighting de la Hoya. Then he beat Oscar.
That was his moment.
He should look to himself and ask what it was he did at that critical juncture, not just what Manny did. He stopped fighting. Manny just did his job.
Where Floyd is very wrong and consiistently so is thinking he is bigger that Boxing. No one is. The fans, the sport, waits for no one. Vacuums may take longer to fill but rest assured, the same way Floyd’s popularity spike was filled by Manny’s, we the fans, the networks and the business will find and annoint new stars sooner or later.
Stardom requires visibility. Floyd pulled back (retired) just when he maight have accelerated his career and galvanized his position. The iriny and good news is that he still can. He just needs to fight more often.
Money can buy a lot of things but it can also corrupt many. In Floyd’s case, his independence and earning ability has made him the ‘occasional’ champion. That …mixed with greater activity and success….has made Manny far more the ’people’s’ champ.
But as I saiid, there is still plenty of time.
It is up to Floyd to write his own history.
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
after the Oscar victory, and leading up to the Hatton victory I felt Floyd was an ATG, and he was at the height of his abilities/popularity. All he had to do was keep fighting, I agree. Notice all his legal problems happened AFTER his retirement, not before or during. I guess the domestic violence was his cocaine (Calzaghe, Hatton, Oscar etc.) post retirement. RJJ was once in that position, Pacquiao was, Oscar was… that pple are on the edges of their seats just to see them fight or make an appearance. Going back to Scott’s recent quote…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqPRwq3QJsk
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
floyd jr. carefully tailored his career to be undefeated, to have the most belts, to receive the least amount of damage, and to gain the most amount of money. Pacquiao fought and beat everyone, and except for his last 3-4 fights, has not cherry picked his opponents at all…
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
There’s the difference. Floyd has not beaten all the best. If you look at Zab Judah’s resume, he’s fought way better fighters than Floyd including Kosta Tzyu, Miguel Cotto in his prime, Josh Clottey, Amir Khan… Floyd’s best fights were Diego Corrales, Zab Judah, Jose Luis Castillo, Ricky Hatton, an Old Oscar, and an Old Mosley. All of those fighters are a step below Judah’s biggest fights…
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
Cotto beat a better version of Mosley, and Mosley beat a better version of Oscar, Collazo already had beaten Hatton, and Judah was knocked out by Tzyu and beat up by Baldomir… so where’s the best on Floyd Jr.’s resume again?
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
Collazo did not beat Hatton.
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
Collazo won in the eyes of many, including myself. The fight led to Floyd jr. vs. Hatton. It was no less of a gift than Marquez Pacquiao.
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
Oh ok well if the eyes of many including yourself
…think he won..then I guess that ends this convo.
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
http://www.boxingnews24.com/2007/12/collazo-beat-hatton-he-got-a-gift-mayweather/
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
I didn't know Floyd's is the ultimate judge of who wins and loses
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/boxing/4769285.stm Even the brits had it close. Did you even watch the fight?
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
Yes I did watch the fight
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
So if you can’t admit that Collazo, who’s good but not at the top of the division at the time, gave Hatton a very hard, close fight, and could be argued that he won the fight… if you can’t admit to either of those two points than we’re at an impasse… or wearing Floyd goggles.
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
Ricky wasn’t a big force at 147, that was my original pont.
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
I can agree with those things
..but that’s not what you said before…you said Hatton lost to Collazo, which he did not. Those are very different things.
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
it’s an opinion, not a fact. I would still say to this day Marquez won the 3rd fight. The words “Pacquiao officially won” won’t escape my lips. Hell, I thought Collazo whooped Berto too. Glen Johnson beat Dawson in their first fight, Clottey beat cotto, and winky destroyed taylor to a “draw”, but I’m full of opinions yo.
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
I think we’re misunderstanding the concept of commenting, which seems to rely on opinion a lot, quite a bit here.
I understand just fine
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
Probably Corrales and Castillo, but I still think Oscar was a very good, legit win, as with Hatton.
"Occasionally, there is a boxing match that, in its demonstration of skill, courage, intelligence, hope, seems to redeem the sport - almost. Perhaps boxing has always been a sport in crisis, a sport of crisis."
by Oli Goldstein on Jan 19, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
But can’t we agree Hatton wasn’t nec. a force to be reckoned with at 147? Collazo banged him up good, and I think Cotto could have ended his career effectively…
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
Well, maybe he wasn’t, but he was the legitimate champion at light welterweight. I wouldn’t say it’s Floyd’s best win at 147, but it’s not a bad win by any means.
"Occasionally, there is a boxing match that, in its demonstration of skill, courage, intelligence, hope, seems to redeem the sport - almost. Perhaps boxing has always been a sport in crisis, a sport of crisis."
by Oli Goldstein on Jan 19, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Ortiz is probably his best win at welterweight. There are fair gripes with Mayweather’s record, no doubt.
"Occasionally, there is a boxing match that, in its demonstration of skill, courage, intelligence, hope, seems to redeem the sport - almost. Perhaps boxing has always been a sport in crisis, a sport of crisis."
by Oli Goldstein on Jan 19, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
No, those guys are not steps below Joshua Clottey and Amir Khan.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Jan 19, 2012 1:17 PM EST up reply actions
Pacquiao hasn't fought and beat everyone
He lost to Morales. “In the eyes of many” he lost to Marquez the second time they fought.
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
true
As a tall guy, you gotta make the shorter guy take risks to get to you. Go through a bad neighborhood to get you.
In fairness, the first Morales fight was reasonably close and he wiped the floor with the guy in the next two fights.
I don't think me pointing out the loss was being unfair.
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
Thanks for quoting me, I feel famous. BTW- I thought clottey’s counter punching and defense, and Mosley’s movement made him look bad too.
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
Mosley wasn’t moving, he was running around. I reserve “movement” for motion that leads to offense of any kind. Mosley was just doing laps.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Jan 19, 2012 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
Pacquiao also wasn’t cutting off the ring… it takes two to make a lousy fight. Actually Pacquiao wasn’t on his toes, he was flat footed, only did jab jab cross, jab cross, and lead left cross and reload in a straight line over and over again like the Marquez fight… there were no angles, there was no Manilla ice, there was no bouncing on his toes and the 6-8 punch combinations like the Cotto fight. And Mosley slipped and evaded shots effectively imo. Nazeem: “You gave others the game plan to beat him.”
"According to all the laws of aerodynamics the bumble-bee should not fly, but the bumble-bee does not know this and so flies anyway."
I said then that I felt Pacquiao showed decline in that fight. Some people got all mad. But no, Pacquiao wasn’t making it a lousy fight, and it does not take two people to make a bad fight. Not all bad fights are Dyah Davis-Alfonso Lopez. Mosley made that a bad fight, just like Clottey made it a bad fight with Pacquiao, just with a different approach to being boring.
Naazim: “This is going to be a great fight and Shane Mosley definitely isn’t shot.”
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Jan 19, 2012 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
Floyd carries with him many of the prejudices one would hope, given his background, he might not only appreciate but work to overcome. He has shown (the private video rant being but the worst example) very little understanding and appreciation for the lives and obstacles others have had to overcome, whether they be race, color, poverty, etc.
Thus you are right when you state
The entire career path of Manny Pacquiao makes no sense to someone like Floyd Mayweather
Floyd is a great fighter but as a person he still has a lot of growing up to do.
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
I don't think he's ever really going to grow up
it just strikes me as something that’s just not going to happen
As a tall guy, you gotta make the shorter guy take risks to get to you. Go through a bad neighborhood to get you.
time is a persistent educator.
It gets through to most of us fools eventually.
Boxing writer: "Iran, what are you going to do when you retire?"
Iran Barkley: "Rob your house"
I don’t think it is a matter of Floyd not recognizing the entireity of Manny’s career, or the differences in how each was brought up, on the contrary, I think he is fully aware of those differences and he simply can not accept them. I think at the bottom of this is a bit or a lot of envy. Like you mention, Floyd is a throughbred, born into the sport and raised as a kid to be a champion, and expected to be one from his days as an amateur. Manny on the other hand had no big expectations or support early on.
To compare them to football stars, to me Floyd is the equivalent of Payton Manning, someone raised from childhood to be the best QB ever, someone dedicated 100% to his craft, as technically gifted as anyone, and as smart as a QB can be. While Manny I think is more in the mold of a Brady, with no guarantees of success early on, and who apparently had to do more with less to succeed.
I think Floyd simply can not fathom how with such disparate backgrounds both can be equally successful today. Reminds me of the scene in the movie of Patch Adams when the character of Phillip Seymour Hoffman accuses Patch Adams (Robin Williams) of cheating for getting better grades than him, and his only excuse is that he came from a family of doctors and he was raised to be a doctor his entire life therefore it was not possible for Patch to be better than him without cheating.
I don't think...
…this is a case of Floyd not understanding Pac’s rise to fame because it’s different then his particular path. I think this is Floyd "just sayin’ " something without actually saying it. You know what this something is.
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
by erod on Jan 19, 2012 1:01 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Ding ding ding, we have a winner
I don’t think Floyd’s getting philosophical about upbringings and paths to stardom. I think he’s suggesting, as he does consistently, that Manny’s rise to superstardom is a result of steroid use.
Gotta say, though, I like that he’s keeping the pressure up on Arum here.
Guys, I wasn’t saying that’s what Floyd said here. Here’s what I said about the Mayweather quote:
I do know what Mayweather is saying, and having this level of confidence and ego is a big part of why Floyd is as good as he is, but I do feel it’s worth saying that Manny Pacquiao was also a very good fighter in the 1990s, winning a world title at flyweight.
It always seems odd to me that Floyd or anyone else has any belief that Manny Pacquiao “came out of nowhere.” He’s been a top fighter for 14 years. He was widely regarded as the No. 2 P4P fighter in the sport back when he was at 130 pounds, behind only Mayweather.
The rest is not specifically about the quote, just something to talk about. I get caught up in waves of thought sometimes and just let myself go with them.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Jan 19, 2012 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
Well in Floyd’s defense, Manny Pacquiao was really your average, run of the mill, C-level four division champion in 2007. THEN OUT OF NOWHERE, he turned into a super fighter, winning belts in four more divisions.
Seems a little fishy to me…
Hey, there’s a whole website that wants to do nothing but discuss this! And it’s not this one! To Fight Hype with ya!
I think he is being sarcastic. Hard to be a C-level 4 division champion.
But I could be wrong.
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
Yes I was being sarcastic! Pacquiao was an excellent fighter before Oscar and super stardom. As Scott pointed out in the article and comments, he hardly “came out of nowhere”. He was a foreigner in weight divisions people didn’t watch much for a big chunk of his career, but he was always a great fighter.
I don’t like getting into who people have or haven’t fought. But I Agee with FM that Pacquiao doesn’t touch him. In my opinion he has never not looked good in any fight
by RRod806 on Jan 19, 2012 2:31 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
Pacquaio has never looked good in ANY fight?
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
I think he’s saying that Floyd always looks good, whereas Pacquiao only sometimes looks good. I disagree with him, for what it’s worth, but apparently RRod806 didn’t watch the shit-stain that was Mayweather-Baldomir.
"Occasionally, there is a boxing match that, in its demonstration of skill, courage, intelligence, hope, seems to redeem the sport - almost. Perhaps boxing has always been a sport in crisis, a sport of crisis."
by Oli Goldstein on Jan 19, 2012 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah I realized I read that wrong. My brain was very puzzled for a minute there (which doesn’t take much, admittedly).
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
This depends on one’s definition of looking good. Some people think someone looks good because they just win every round. Some people want more excitement. I think that’s the most common division among people when they evaluate Floyd.
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
I do really enjoy watching Floyd fight, but when he’s up against a guy like Baldomir and he just stays in first gear for 12 rounds, well, that to me isn’t looking good.
"Occasionally, there is a boxing match that, in its demonstration of skill, courage, intelligence, hope, seems to redeem the sport - almost. Perhaps boxing has always been a sport in crisis, a sport of crisis."
by Oli Goldstein on Jan 19, 2012 2:49 PM EST up reply actions
I agree. I even think he did sort of the same thing with Oscar. I think he could have beaten Oscar bad but he seemed content to hunt-and-peck his way to a decision.
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 2:52 PM EST up reply actions
That’s like saying Usain Bolt didn’t look fast in the Olympics because he coasted the last few meters after he had already blown away the competition.
by RRod806 on Jan 19, 2012 4:52 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Not really. It’s like Usain Bolt running 9.9 knowing Asafa Powell can only run 10.
"Occasionally, there is a boxing match that, in its demonstration of skill, courage, intelligence, hope, seems to redeem the sport - almost. Perhaps boxing has always been a sport in crisis, a sport of crisis."
by Oli Goldstein on Jan 19, 2012 9:12 PM EST up reply actions
Oh yeah the Baldomir fight. I did see it but i don’t remember thinking to myself.. Damn Mayweather lost that one.
by RRod806 on Jan 19, 2012 4:47 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Who said they thought he lost it?
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 5:21 PM EST up reply actions
No one. Im just saying that I’m always convinced that he looks good in fights and clearly wins everytime. Although Castillio gave him a tough fight.
Also, I’m sorry for not being very clear in my statements. It’s been tough to chime in from work.
by RRod806 on Jan 19, 2012 5:27 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Yeah, I don’t remember thinking Mayweather lost that one either. Great point, thanks for your input.
"Occasionally, there is a boxing match that, in its demonstration of skill, courage, intelligence, hope, seems to redeem the sport - almost. Perhaps boxing has always been a sport in crisis, a sport of crisis."
by Oli Goldstein on Jan 19, 2012 9:13 PM EST up reply actions
Wait, I think I read that wrong.
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
Never looked good in any fight? Uhm… did you hear that from your seeing-eye dog? :-)
It is not the mountain we conquer but ourselves.
- Edmund Hillary
by Stevosaurus Rex on Jan 19, 2012 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
To be clear, he said that Floyd has never had an off-night or a bad performance, which Pacquiao has.
Bad Left Hook
"To the town of Agua Fria rode a stranger one fine day..."
by Scott Christ on Jan 19, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
I actually scored that fight narrowly for Castillo, but at least Floyd had some real moments in it. I don’t know if the statement (that Floyd has never NOT looked good) is literally true, but it’s pretty close. Floyd’s brilliant defense and counter-punching skills will always give him a few great moments in a fight.
+1 on Castillo 1
Definitely was Floyd’s toughest fight…
"Boxing is like dealing with a ho"
-Bernard Hopkins
I scored it a draw
Many people seem to give castillo the round were Floyd got a point deduction which makes no sense in my opinion.
After the short break for the point deduction Castillo went on the offence but Floyd had controlled majority of that round, thus making it a 9-9 round isntead of 10-8 like That dummy Lendermann had it
by Mohammedini Hussein on Jan 19, 2012 4:40 PM EST up reply actions
I think he looked ho-hum against Victoriano Sosa at lightweight back in ‘03. He also didn’t look great against Carlos Hernandez but that could be blamed on broken hands.
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
Thx. Maybe I wasn’t real clear. The Castillo fight was very competitive. He still fought really well in that fight.
by RRod806 on Jan 19, 2012 4:44 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Usual Mayweather crap, “theres no blueprint to beat me”, yada yada yada.
by Shitali Klitschko on Jan 19, 2012 3:39 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Im just tired of this pity party of who had it rougher growing up. Boxing is a tough sport, you have to fight for years before you getting anywhere. There are plenty of stories of fighters rising above their circumstances to reach the top.
There’s nothing wrong with telling the story, I’m just tired of people comparing formally poor people to other formally poor people, it’s kind of a useless discussion.
Maybe they should just fight to prove it....
"The bell that tolls for all in boxing belongs to a cash register."
-Bob Verdi
I’m almost scared if they fight because then we will have to hear endless amounts of people say that the winner is really the GOAT. If Mayweather and Pacquiao fans are crazy now, imagine if their guy actually beats the other.
@KoryKitchen32 on twitter
by Kory Kitchen on Jan 19, 2012 6:06 PM EST up reply actions
Bottom line
They have to fight. The rest is BooShit
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
If they fight once, there will have to be a second fight to somehow legitimize the result of the first, and that will engender more years of negotiating idiocy. Then, there would have to be yet more years of the same idiocy leading up to yet a third, the de rigueuer “rubber match.”
If there is a God, they won’t fight.
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