Arum Says No To Sergio Martinez For Julio Cesar Chavez Jr
by Waldo Rastel on Feb 9, 2012 11:15 PM EST
in Boxing News Analysis
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This piece of news may come as a shock to most of you, but to try to keep it together. Bob Arum wants to wait at least two fights before letting him get a shot a Sergio Martinez according to Bob Velin of USA Today. No, Arum isn't using the ‘we need to let the fight marinate' excuse. This time he is using a ‘he is making progress' excuse.
"Obviously, Chavez is going to end up fighting Martinez. I think they know that," Arum said. "But he's not going to fight him next. You have to understand, Chavez is getting better and better, but there's still room for improvement, there's still stuff that Freddie wants to see.
"I would think Chavez would have two more fights and then fight Martinez."
"It's stupid to take a kid like Chavez and throw him in before my matchmakers and Freddie agree he's ready. He's getting there. If he wasn't getting there, we'd probably say, 'What the hell, what have we got to lose? But he is getting there, and I was very, very impressed with him in the last fight."
Of course this statement is in direct contradiction with the statement that Junior will be the world's best middleweight by 2012. Also, this type of talk makes sense when you are talking about a young prospect, but Junior is going to be turning 26 this week. He has had 46 professional fights and is a titleholder, do you really think there is going to be a huge improvement from his current level. I know Freddie Roach helps fighters get better but he isn't a miracle worker. Clearly, the Top Rank team is waiting for Martinez to get older and is avoiding the other challenges in the division. Chavez and Arum are leaning toward a fight with Andy Lee who is coming off of a victory over Brian Vera, avenging his only loss.
On a scale of 1 to 10, how bad is this excuse from Bob Arum?
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I dunno whats more likely to happen, floyd fighting pac or jr fighting someone worth a shit.
by TheDreadedMarco on Feb 9, 2012 11:28 PM EST via mobile reply actions
If you’re not going to fight Martinez then give him back his belt!!!
by theninthlayer on Feb 9, 2012 11:36 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I don’t think it’s an excuse at all. He’s saying they don’t want to fight Martinez right now. They don’t.
So, 0.
Bad Left Hook
"The internet has undermined professionalism in journalism, which is a good thing." - Bill James
i think it’s an excuse. i don’t think it’s an either/or. arum is clearly saying they don’t want to fight Martinez now, and he’s giving an excuse as to why – that junior isn’t ready skill-wise right now (vs the money isn’t right, there’s an injury, or whatever other garbage arum has in his vast sewage aresenal). is the excuse that junior isn’t ready is a good one? i agree with waldo that it’s crap, because i don’t think junior will be ready for martinez in a year, either.
It's an explanation.
He said he is not ready. How much clearer can you be. The fact is JCC is not at all ready but he is not going anywhere soon. He will be matched in competitive fights that are “his to win or lose”…and it is on him to continue to win.
IF he does, I believ we will see Martinez at some time. But now…fuggetaboutit.
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
not sure what straw man you are trying to chop down here. i’m not discussing whether arum was ambiguous in what he said. i’m discussing whether what arum said is an “excuse,” and i think it is because it’s an explanation for why something ain’t happening.
Definition of Excuse
A reason or explanation put forward to defend or justify a fault or offense.
He is defending anything. He is being totally upfront and saying Chavez is not ready.
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
Excuses and reasons aren’t the same things.
Bad Left Hook
"The internet has undermined professionalism in journalism, which is a good thing." - Bill James
by Scott Christ on Feb 10, 2012 2:24 AM EST up reply actions
didn’t say they are. i see an excuse as a reason for not doing something, and that seems to fit the bill here.
A father who says his daughter is not mature enough to be dating young men is not making an excuse. He is _explaining_that he does not believe she is ready to do so.
Chavez is a work in progress. Martinez about as seasoned as you can get without getting grizzled. Those are facts.
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
It IS an excuse,
b/c JCC Jr. won’t improve enought to be “ready” in 1 year, or frankly ever. Now, Martinez may decline enough so that at some point it is winable, but the idea that Freddie Roach makes JCC Jr. “ready” in two more fights is absurd.
Arum is correct about this: Martinez would beat JCC Jr. if they fought next.
I smoke on the mic like Smokin' Joe Frazier
As one who has been a critic of Martinez on plenty of occassions, I’m not sure that he is so unbeatable.
The kid ain’t his father but in a year or so he might in fact be ready for all of us to find out just just how good he can be or is. Rubio was a step up fight, arranged to see what and where Junior is at this moment. It was junior’s to win or lose. It was no gimme. He passed that test. Let’s watch. He’s a handful. I’m not so sure he can’t be competitive soon. The operative word being NOT SURE.
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
Minus 5. Just can wait until DuBoef take his place.
by MontrealBoxing on Feb 10, 2012 12:10 AM EST reply actions
Down With Wilco
Bad Left Hook
"The internet has undermined professionalism in journalism, which is a good thing." - Bill James
by Scott Christ on Feb 10, 2012 12:24 AM EST up reply actions
why don't you just buy
different amps
He knows the guy with the bandage on his ass is going no were. Were you going fucking no were
by Elstriko on Feb 10, 2012 2:06 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
hello cleveland
He knows the guy with the bandage on his ass is going no were. Were you going fucking no were
by Elstriko on Feb 10, 2012 6:19 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
People that want to see this fight
Only want it so Sergio can get his just dues. No fan of JCCjr would want him anywhere near Martinez for at least another year, and that includes Arum.
In terms of sport, the idea of a champion needing time to develop before the champion is ready to take on a contender is pretty laughable. Only in boxing.
If Chavez was not holding a title that said he was the ‘middleweight champion of the world’, the situation would be okay to me. I wouldn’t mind the fact that he is on HBO against less than stellar opposition, as his fights are generally entertaining and he is one of the few fighters in North America that can legitimately draw a house and tv ratings. Instead, Top Rank parade Chavez around with the WBC title, which of course helps his ability to draw a house and tv ratings, as now all of his fights are ‘world tite’ fights.
Meanwhile, the real middleweight champion of the world has been stripped of all of his titles and is not allowed to challenge for the WBC title on account of the fact that he is currently too good of a boxer to challenge for the title. Ugh
Nobody will read this and care and why should they?
by Eoin_not_ian on Feb 10, 2012 3:57 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
So I guess, Arum will let Chavez Jr give up his belt, or will there be some other back door negotiations to keep Chavez’s status the way it is for the next year or so?
If they fight Lee, DiBella is basically making the choice to put Lee ahead of Martinez. I really think that’s a factor there. It buys more time for Chavez and the belt.
Bad Left Hook
"The internet has undermined professionalism in journalism, which is a good thing." - Bill James
by Scott Christ on Feb 10, 2012 5:18 AM EST up reply actions
He's not ready
I don’t think Junior will be ready within two fights. Pretty blunt statement about his title holder’s skills… A “champ” who’s not ready?
"The tempt for greatness is the biggest drug in the world."
—Mike Tyson
by honorablecbm on Feb 10, 2012 6:31 AM EST via iPhone app reply actions
well, and now what is going to say the wbc?
by EL CIERTO (VEN) on Feb 10, 2012 8:09 AM EST reply actions
Excuses, excuses
Saying someone who is a titleholder (no matter how they got it) is not ready for another fighter in their division is an excuse. If JCC Jr did not have a belt, then it is a reason. Simply give up the belt, continue to draw big crowds and get high ratings and never fight Sergio. Just don’t call yourself a champ and then say you aren’t skilled enough to fight a guy. Total BS.
The belt is more of a joke than the kid
Fuck the belt.
"Silence is golden when you can't think of a good answer"
---- Muhammed Ali
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